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We are independent contractors. Unless you are with an agency or a pimp. Other independent contractors have similar issues with undercutting prices.. Ask anyone who works in a trade. Be it painting houses, paving driveways, building a deck... Even holistic practitioners, massage therapists, hair dressers... I'm quite sure there's no union or industry minimum for those and several other independent contractor jobs. The proposition of an industry standard is the pipe dream.. very unrealistic in my opinion. One of the best parts of my job is that I'm completely my own boss.... I do not want anyone dictating to me that I can't work for my own set price that I decide I am choosing. While I have chosen a minimum time that I will book for a client of 30 min.. I have in the past done 15 min appts. I even have had one regular who after booking his initial time for my min came back to see me several times.. but since he was a minimum wage worker and literally was in and out in one song I didn't have the heart to charge him more than $50.. In a set price model would I have to charge him more now? or do this behind the back of whomever is telling me the price I can charge? THAT right there takes away my freedom to be my own boss. No thanks!

I am actually shocked that this thread has been allowed to stay open so long. It is certainly against the spirit of this board. This isn't a reasoned debate it is akin to a bunch of nosy neighbours peeking their heads over a fence and then gossiping about the state of your neighbours yard, complaining about what they are doing in the privacy of their own yard etc. No one has the right to dictate to any provider what they think their rates should be. That is up to the individual provider. They decide what services they offer and at what rate. Face it, this is a business in what is essentially a free-market economy and subject to all the pressures that every other business faces. Despite what the service is, you are still selling a service. You are the provider and you need customers to buy your service. The market decides if the service you are selling is what the consumer wants, and is value for the money. You can charge $400, minimum 2 hour appointment, CBJ, no greek and be happy with that decision. You believe there is a market for that service. It should not matter to you that another provider is doing BBBJ in 15 minute sessions for $80. They feel they too have a market for that service. If either of them don't have clients for their service then maybe they have to look at their business model and adjust. That is how business works in our society. We have had these debates before about rates, BBBJ vs CBJ, sliding rate scales based on service etc. This is not the place for it. It is just collusion in disguise. Setting up a "hooker marketing board" like we do with milk, and eggs etc is not an option, and is a pretty absurd idea. I will say it once again, Nobody has the right to dictate what another can charge for their service. Mind your own business and stop blaming others for your lack of knowledge on the current business climate. If people don't value your service the same way you do, then maybe you should look at alternate types of employment, and not try and stifle your competition.

I Don't Want Your Pity: Sex Work and Labor Politics By Belle Knox http://www.huffingtonpost.com/belle-knox/sex-work-politics_b_5148528.html

Cat, you said: And then went on to say that the advocates speak from a level of priviledge and don't understand the hardships faced by those with less priviledge. However, with the minimum pricing you are suggesting, that in its very self doesn't take into consideration the less priviledged workers you claim to understand. Do you really think it fair to dictate a minimum price that *ALL* providers must adhere to? The street-based workers, the workers who would be excluded from working for a third-party due to past legal problems or addiction/mental health issues or immigrant status, the workers who only wish to work part-time, the workers who are on the "edge" of society's idea of what constitutes the norm for gender expression or body type or sexuality, the workers who want to "only" provide X and Y services, but not Z services? You are not advocating protection for those workers. You're advocating a tiered system that would only feed into the stigmatization and marginalization faced by workers. And yes, I do believe we should be advocating from the position of and consideration for the less priviledged because historically they have been the ones to bear the majority of the criminalization, stigmatization, and marginalization compared to other sectors within the sex trade. Additional Comments: Alright, I can make comparisons all night: If Sally wants to start babysitting and offers her services for $5/hr, and Jimmy, Sue, and Polly all have been babysitting for a number of years, is it then fair for the three of them to dictate Sally's prices? What if Sally has no experience, but the other three do? What if Sally comes from a single-family home and understands that not all families come from the same socio-economic backgrounds as the other three children? Your experience is different from mine. That doesn't make it any more or less valid, and doesn't mean you are a fountain of wisdom that trumps mine every time. We are coming at this from different angles, the only difference is that you are only considering the indoor workers, and yes, that would be *more* priviledged workers. Including other providers, who do so out of motivation for their own interests. Saying that we need to protect these poor, disadvantaged women who don't know what they are getting into is really invalidating and infantilizing. Provide guidance should people wish to access those support services, but don't presume to know what is best for everyone or what everyone "should" do. By dictating a mandatory minimum, which, let's face it, would come from the position of an indoor worker, you would be sentencing those who cannot command those prices to work illegally, unsafely, and in the darkness. That is not protecting those providers.

I think a more important question is: how would the mandatory minimum be enforced? It's a scary thought. I do echo Kathryn's concerns, as well.

So, yes. Some folks are stretching their finances by seeing SPs. They may not be able to afford any more than the rate the lady they're seeing charges. Fair enough. I'm not going to judge anybody on the basis of their financial situation. However... although we might talk about money here on the board, we put a lot of effort into not doing so when we meet. Ladies don't like having to ask for the envelope. We guys don't like it much if she counts the money in front of us. We may vary in how much we dislike those things, but I don't think very many people think of them positively. Talking or thinking about the money ruins the fantasy that we work so hard to maintain. But then... you ask for change. This tells me two things: first, that you're too lazy to get hold of the right amount in advance; second, that you care little enough about a provider's feelings that you're prepared to put her through the awkwardness of dealing with it. Really, it's not hard to have the right money. No matter what the ATM spits out, is it really so difficult to make sure you have 10s and 20s in your wallet so you can make the envelope up to the right amount? All you have to do is... not spend them for a couple of days beforehand. And as for asking for change... so you not understand that we're dealing with a fantasy here, and that doing so destroys it? Do you not realize that even if you don't care, she might well do? Can you not work this out, or do you simply not care how she feels? As I said, I won't judge you based on your financial situation... but I have no problem with judging you for other things: firstly for your laziness, and secondly for either your selfishness or your stupidity, whichever applies.

I say...we are all the same height laying down LOL...heheh...

I wouldn't change a thing. Honesty, i could nit pick over little stupid cosmetic things, but the truth is I love everything about me. I am a woman - a real woman. Not a Barbie doll. If someone doesn't like what they see, they can look elsewhere. I look in the mirror and see a beautiful woman everyday.

I've been reading this thread closely and, while the discussion has been frank, sometimes blunt, and there are strong and conflicting opinions, it's been pretty civil. It's been valuable to me to read these different yet honest views of real, live women who do sex work for a living and each know what they're talking about. Although I can see how this might make some people (especially consumers) uncomfortable, I disagree that the discussion is un-CERB-y. A thread whose premise was "Sally X is charging way too little! Let's confront her!" would be bad. A general thread about "hey, how are prices set? How should they be set?" strikes me as smack-bang on topic for the board -- provided it's civil. I think as long as there are informed and respectful viewpoints to share, those inclined to contribute something meaningful should be allowed to do so. For my part: I don't know anything about the experience of being a sex worker so I only have vague concepts to go on. My uninformed feeling is that "enforcement" of prices is bad in principle for a bunch of reasons. But... what about a hypothetical voluntary sex workers' association that reaches out to SPs, invites them to work with their fellow providers, and keeps newbies informed about their options in the business? One that just invites everyone to cooperate to help maximize revenue from a very human and intimate service? I'd be cool with that. It would have problems and failings of its own, but it would have a lot of human merit, too. Open, free markets are sometimes efficient... but they're never, ever wise or compassionate, and some of that is necessary too.

when I'm on my knees;) they are all taller. I hope you don't mind me responding:) I love height, I come from a tall family and I am considered short by their standards. Perhaps that's why I'm so comfortable in heels. I have met some very sexy men that are on the shorter side, so long as he has confidence then I'll find him attractive no matter his elevation:)

like i said the other thread, taller for me...to see a lady eye to eye when i walk in the room is a real turn on...and my preference is towards taller women, just something about sexy long legs and the stature. Now i don't mind shorter women, and would never judge someone for being shorter. but to me anyways, tall is sexy...

Christy I think I agree with everything you have said except your comments about price being the dominant factor... i would agree that price is asked ... lol all of us have to know if we can afford the service but once I know it is not outside my price range I really don't shop around based on cost. most of the ladies I have seen I have seen repeatedly and it has not really crossed my mind to look for something cheaper. Just my opinion

I'm 5'2", so most men are much taller then me. There are occasions that my man is shorter then me when I'm wearing my heals, and its interesting cause it rarely happens - I do like it cause it gives me an idea of what its like to be taller then someone else. I like both taller then me, shorter then me and the same height. Its whats in the middle that counts (hehe) and where it lands on my body when we are embracing each other. However, once on the bed, height doesn't matter.

But yet you seem to feel you have the right to dictate what can be said here:) I'm curious who is it that you are referring to as having lack of knowledge on the current business model? With all due respect :)as a gentleman and one who if I am to assume correctly, has no ties to this business other than hiring or speaking to providers, how can you speak to what is best for us or to what our business model is, what we should charge, how and why?:) I am a provider who could care less about what others charge as I am one who does not need this to support myself or anyone else, so for me there is no competition, I can survive with 1 or 100 or no clients. But I do find the idea of a having a minimum price set a great idea and one that would benefit everyone. I would think all the gents chiming in would be the only ones who could possibly have anything to loose if one was set, after all variations in rates benefit you the client not the providers. But that's my skewed view;) I can speak to this as I have been in other service fields as an owner and a worker and even though there were variables in rates the differences were never more than 5-20$ so a minimum must have been set with possibly exceptions for seasonal sales or promotions. As providers we all should want one another to prosper and not be taken advantage of by anyone, misinformed or undervalued. To protect one another and if we are concerned and coming together concerning the changes in the laws why not do the same for our rates. After all how is making more or not going below a certain rate a bad thing for any provider? My last comment would be to those who think that a client is dedicated enough to stick with a girl no matter her rate-seriously? A client is a client and those who have their favorites and stick to one are the few and far between, the exceptions rather than the rule. Most men shop around and rates are a motivation for most not a girls looks, attitude, or services. If that weren't the case then why in all the years that I've been in and out of this business in all its facets has the first and foremost question asked by a client calling is "so what are your rates" lol! In the end probably nothing will change but planting a seed/a thought perhaps may cause some to think and sometimes with thought comes change. Cat said it best though, as usual:)

First let me thank you for the personal attack... i do in fact pay attention to many issues... i do agree that Mr. Harper has stayed clear of the abortion issue even though he personally does not agree with abortion... but that's not really that surprising there is no political upside to opening the abortion debate as he would be severely impacted in the next election as abortion is a topic that Canadians especially women would consider when voting. Suggesting that a bill that would make sex work illegal is similar is kinda like comparing Apples and Oranges... Mr Harper is astute enough to understand that while most Canadians are not in favor of making sex work illegal they also will not see this issue as something that drives them when they go to the polls. If as many suggest Mr. Harper goes with a Canadian version of the Nordic model which makes prostitution legal but the purchasing of Sex illegal then it would have a significant impact on me a purchaser of the service. So I can sit and trust that the Government will do what is right or I can express my opinion and try to influence the outcome. As for my choice in who I read and listen to let me just say that I am not a resident of Ontario and therefore seldom if ever read the Toronto Star... as for CBC radio... and Mr. Fife... they would not be part of my daily routine. I am looking forward to reading the actual legislation but refuse to sit back with rose colored glasses thinking that Mr. Harper will do the right thing. Just my opinion.

shopping? me! me! me! :P

Something strange, seen in England. A 16-year-old girl took a pic. What can it be? Aliens? One of those weather phenomena? A swarm of locusts? Apparently not... Oh. My. God. They have a trebuchet that throws fireballs. I want one. (via Boing Boing)

There is a difference between having a voice, and dictating decisions without realizing how they may affect people differently. What if all the higher-priced providers got together and decided the industry minimum should be $1000/hr? So, again, who gets to decide what the minimum would be, and who would it affect?

I've been at this almost 25 years.. I started as a student and was charging $125 1/2 hr, $230/hr.. When I moved to Ottawa I matched what most ladies were charging $150 1/2 hr and $250/hr.. BUT when I was arrested in the mid 90's I went underground mostly.. and worked out of another ladies incall who's father was a judge! so I felt safe that he'd protect me same as her if it came down to it.. whether he would have or not.. I felt okay. She was only charging $80 for half hr.. so I matched it for the short few weeks I was there.. I thought I would be run off my feet!!! Nope.. same amount of clients.. including a few who found me under a different name (keeping in mind this was only paper ads and no pics) solely by my stats.. some guys have a type! I was also doing this in a completely diff part of the city in Toronto. I learned a very good lesson.. I may mostly get different clients at a different price point... BUT I got the same number of clients pretty much at basically 30% lower rate. Of course that isn't true to any infinite rate value.. Having said that...Lower rates generally will get you more volume and higher rates less volume. Rates over $250 now esp over $350 will bring you much less business simply because there is a smaller piece of the pie now to go around (less clientelle to escort ratio). You don't know the circumstances of anyone out there.. whether they have had a great deal of debt come upon them quickly and need to get their head above water? or do they have a comfortable 2nd income that makes escorting a part time venture. There are so many factors to consider.. and it's not an easy one.

You can't look at this business as a by-the-hour salary. We don't work eight hours a day, five days a week. The time and money that goes into replying to message boards, replying to emails, posting ads, taking phone calls, self-care/hygiene, photo shoots, the cost of maintaining an incall or transportation to outcalls, website upkeep, travel costs for touring etc. eats into that "per hour" figure as well. This business also ebbs and flows, and there are downtimes that balance out busy periods. We don't have sick time or vacation pay. Yes, this can be a very touchy subject, especially when there are assumptions made. Additional Comments: 1. They're not "selling themselves". We sell a service, not our bodies. Let's not use the same language abolitionist groups use when creating moral panic and conflating human trafficking with sex work. 2. "Too cheap" -- according to whom? There are many reasons why someone chooses to set their rates at what they are, and quite honestly, it's not up to us to judge. There is no regulatory board that oversees our industry. To some people, my rates can be "too high" or "too low". To that, I say that is none of your business. It's MY business. My rates have increased since I started in this business, as I figured out what my expenses were and how often I wanted to work. They are at a price-point which allows me to see the clients I want to see while maintaining a modest lifestyle and going to school. It has afforded me some opportunities I wouldn't ordinarily have, like buying my first car, but at the same time, I don't feel I am living an extravagant lifestyle (it was a great deal on a used car). There is always going to be someone with lower rates or higher rates than you. That is how this business, and all businesses work. Stop looking at other providers and comparing yourself to them; concentrate on your own self. It's not a matter of "s/he's stealing clients from me", IMHO, but rather "what am *I* doing to attract and retain clients?" 3. Let's not make assumptions about what a "lower" price-point implies, especially when it's making potentially stigmatizing and dangerous statements about having a pimp or drug addiction. We don't know their situation. I'm honestly quite surprised that this thread is still going on, just as I was surprised to see in another thread a provider pose the question of someone she had never met being underage. Statements like the ones in this thread have the possibility of impacting someone else's business and well-being, and not in a good way.

Hey, Does anyone know which ladies have incall locations in the westend of town? Everyone seems to be near the Division & 401 area....

I met with Nina today and man I am glad I did! This girl has it all. Beautiful, sexy and those curves that drive you wild. Her menu is very extensive and is quite skilled when getting down to business. She is very accommodating, sweet and genuine. I would see this girl again in a minute!

That would be a very, very good idea. Not to set or enforce prices; but to provide support to every single provider, so that they can be informed and market-savvy and each set the highest price that works for them.

It boils down to one simple principle. I, and many others believe that a provider should be able to set their own price, and when they do then they should not be bullied or pressured by others to change that price. You do not believe that. You believe that others should decide what a provider charges. I am sorry but even from the provider's comments on this thread, there is a huge difference in opinion on that amongst that community. Who is going to set these prices? Is there going to have to be a "hookers union" or professional association? Will it vary from province to province? Will we allow happy hour pricing? Are you really proposing that we set a mimimum wage for prostitution? Given the many varieties and types of sex work how would that work? A certain price for MA's because they only give manual release? X Dollars for Oral, Y Dollars for Greek etc etc? No extras in the Champagne room, because as Chris Rock says, There is no sex in the champagne room? Sorry for getting a bit absurd here, but the whole idea to me is ludicrous, not to say also a little totalitarian.

I'm tall myself, over 6ft and personally i find a tall woman very sexy. The taller the better. But for some reason lots of guys don't want a woman taller than them, but for me i don't care... I almost prefer it :)

Bring it. :)

A supply management system like a marketing board?....Manitoba Sex Workers Marketing Board or MSWMB for short. Though price fixing and collusion might be an issue for the customers. Peace MG

I think there needs to be a dose of reality injected here against the ideological rhetoric. I appreciate the need to protect those who can't protect themselves as we all know who they are. It doesn't change the fact that the rest of the industry needs to be organized and championed as well. Providers that do not have a voice need to heard including ones that don't practice their trade on a street corner or for $300+/hr... cat

Peter's heads aren't in the game these days .....

Well, I'm an ALO newbie!! ...customer that is. :icon_razz: So far, I'm one for one. And what a one it was. I had a wonderfully sensual time with a very sweet Ksenia. She rekindled my interest in the massage experience.

Sun screen. Going to Vegas for the long weekend, where its sunny and 29c. So long Canadian Spring, hello Sin City sun!

Had it recommended to me by a lady, so I'm brewing a Keurig and just started watching The Hunger Games. Then later today, it's The Hunger Games 2 RG

Thank you for that Savannah. I personally find encounters with ladies are much more than about getting a "happy ending" For me the happy ending begins with the lady entering my hotel room and finishes when we both get dressed and hug and kiss good night. One of the most pleasant memorable encounters I had, we ended up in bed, kissing, caressing and snuggling. But nothing to lead to orgasm. But that's just how the evening naturally and pleasantly unfolded that night. And it was a pleasant memorable encounter for me Anyhow, it was one of many pleasant journeys I have had, and the destination, well it may not always have been what I expected, but there are other wonderful destinations too...if that makes sense A pleasant recollection and rambling RG

Good morning ladies and gentlemen of CERB, Megan and I are both full-time students approaching the end of term. We recently took a bath together thinking we would relax and do some pleasure reading, but experienced a different kind of pleasure instead... hehe We offer private massage duos and private lapdance sessions for discerning ladies and gentlemen. For more information about us, our rates, and our services, please visit our websites at http://www.lovely-nathalie.com and http://www.meganstouch.ca Fondly, Nat xox

For me, I will put my answer very simply... Life is about the journey, not the destination. I feel the same way about sex and intimacy. :)

Trust is a two way street:) If I can trust you to come into my space then you should be able to trust me to come to yours. If a lady is reputable, has a trail, website, reco's etc, then why the worry? The largest part of our business model is discretion and trust. Happy hobbying:)

I am someone that greatly prefer first communication (and hell even after) by e-mail, my phone is starting to be wonky and texting is a bit of a pain. My work account is attached to my personal phone and I see almost instantly when I receive it. Do I reply right away? No. As many lovely ladies have stated we have personal life. We also have to keep up with a lot and posting a short 140 character tweet compare to writing a personal email of 500 words...There is a bit of a difference here. Also-I am someone that tour on a regular base. Emails are most likely to pour in in my inbox than when I stay in a fix town. It's not uncommon to receive well over 10-15 emails a day that are long correspondence, just answering emails can take up about 2 hours each day

I'm curious, why are you taking things this personally. If it is, as you say, business is business, why do you then turn around and talk about thoughts and feelings. If you send an email, get no response, well move on. I could somewhat understand if you develop a connection with a lady that you have seen, and continue to see, and then she wishes to no longer see you, talking about thoughts and feelings. But to contact a SP for an encounter and she doesn't reply, just move on. Honestly, bringing feelings for someone you haven't met strikes me as somewhat strange. Unless there is something more to your post you haven't shared. And if you are getting a steady pattern of no responses to your emails, maybe look at the emails you send. Is there something in the way you write that might concern the lady enough that she might just prefer not to see you, and not reply to your email RG

I have never entertained an SP in my home.... I am kinda thinking my wife would get upset lol..... that said I would love to have a lady over for an overnight.... we have a nice home so the facilities would certainly make it more enjoyable than just a hotel room....cook her a great meal....snuggle on the couch and watch a movie... have dirty passionate sex in lots of location that will provide memories for a long time. Not sure it would ever happen but great fantasy.

I won't speak for touring ladies, though I know many who've shared their stories with me. But in my personal experience, St John's tends to be a place with a lot of last minute requests. Also a lot of asked questions and not a lot of follow through at times. I believe the local fare has made it this way. They take last minute bookings, don't screen, take phone bookings, etc. Makes it VERY challenging for those of us with a different approach. Additionally, just because I live in NL, doesn't mean I live in St. John's and therefore these approaches don't work for me... Especially when I don't have my own incall location!!! I hope others chime in on this one!!!!

That's not true in all cases. I've experienced fine dining, going to well known museums & the theater over the years & have a appreciation for them. Just because I don't have a lot of disposable income anymore does'n mean I wouldn't appreciate these fine ladies if I had the chance.

I can only speak for myself. When I see a lady it is because there is something about her that interests me, that something, a connection, clicking if you will (and yes her looks too ;-) ) are what matter. If I am lucky to meet a companion that I like, even more lucky if I like that companion enough to continue to see her, and most of all fortunate enough that that companion will agree to see me, guess what, I'm not even looking at some lady offering her companionship at reduced rates From my perspective, sorry to phrase it this way considering the nature of this lifestyle, but this isn't about the most bang for your buck. For me it is about meeting and developing special connections with ladies who offer companionship. Companionship being much more than just a sex. And when those connections are made, a new less expensive companion isn't going to even draw my attention. In short, the dollar rate isn't what decides for me who to see, it is the lady herself that decides for me if I'll see her. In short a lower dollar rate won't undercut my client loyalty nor will it affect my choice in companion to see Hope that makes sense A rambling RG

Nathalie has hit it right on the head. Those that have lower rates are not doing it for the purpose of undercutting at all, they are trying to make a living at it. You will always see rates, from a lower level to an upper level, and that has been part of this industry for a many years, from past to present, you can see that today from ad's here,EC,P411,BP or wherever the men seek services.

Saint John has some local talent. They've all been fun so far.

I wouldn't change a thing. I am happy with who I am...and if others don't like what they see...then don't look.

I am the shortest sp I've ever met at 5'1". I have never lied about my height, don't much see the point. I'm not short of anything ;) I don't even lie about my age anymore, I outed myself at the start of the year. LoL On days I do a good yoga session I sometimes gain a quarter inch... amazing how much good posture can affect your height.

I thought that adding Inches was only a Guy Thing.... so now you are telling me there is a risk that an SP might lie and I will end up at a session a couple of inches short of a magical encounter lol

Does anyone know whatever became of Virginia from Pigales? She used to dance there in 2003-2004. Very exotic Latina type with long black hair and enhanced breasts, kinda resembling Penelope Cruz.