fortunateone

6 months to a year is fine, I would think. Anything more than a year I don't think the sp you want to see is going to consider that to be current enough.

You simply use the method by which you contact and book appts with the sps you've seen. Call them if you use the phone and ask, if they are approachable by email maybe do that instead first, give your phone #, and ask if they are willing to be a reference how would they like the sp to contact them. if you only use your phone, then that is how the sp will remember you, not by a cerb handle or email address, btw. If you contact by email, and include your number and info about the last time you met her, then ask for the reference, she has more info to work with when the sp contacts her. I for one even tho all my booking is done by phone call, do not want anyone looking for a reference from me or the sp checking them to phone me. They can email for that.

Your employee may find themselves facing 'living off the avails' charges. Until/unless these laws are changed across Canada, anyone you pay from escort earnings can face that risk. You just have to be aware of that going in, and that by advertising as an agency with someone else responding to calls and doing the booking, that you may draw unwanted attention to yourself, and the booker. Do clients in your area see more value in dealing with a 3rd party, or do they only want to deal directly with the sps herself? Because going agency/booker you might alienate some clients, the same thing happens if you have someone else doing your ad postings, and they have access to your accounts like here on cerb. Not many clients like the idea of someone else reading and replying to messages that they think are going to the sp only.

To all of that I would add why is there this need to distance ourselves from actual human contact, when we are talking about intimate services. You can do it all thru technology, but when you don't speak to a real human being, where is the connection supposed to come from. I don't distance myself from potential clients by filtering them thru text or email., We speak, voice to voice, and have a real time conversation, where my attention they can be assured is on them and only on them. That is the only way you can have a phone conversation. texts and emails, well I can be having multiple conversations. It is not reflecting my desire or ability to connect and focus on just the client or potential client. Plus 2hours of texting or 3 days of emailings, is covered with a 5 minute phone call conversation.

Report the ads to site admin of where the ads are placed. :)

The answer is yes. Just as a woman can do the same thing and not be lesbian, so can a guy perform the action without needing to be straight. It is a giving action anyway, not a receiving one. There is no need for him to become aroused by doing it, just as it isn't necessary if a straight woman was doing the same activity.

Lots of good points here. Just wanted to add in: Someone new to the biz sets a rate according to what they think the rates 'out there' are. Maybe they look at other ads, compare their bodies/ages to those ads, and say that if that one charges 250, then I am worth 300. In other words, new advertisers don't know what, according to clients, they are supposed to be charging for what they provide. Because also if they are new, a couple of things happen. They don't know the business, and don't know how to provide a decent session. They think 'it's sex, I've had sex so I can do this". They don't factor in that their clients will be a variety of people, and they have no clue how to screen them so they see everyone. Being new a lot of clients will contact them, so they are seeing a lot of people in one day. So they get tired, they get distracted that all their clients don't look or smell as good as they'd like to have in front of them, and their phone is ringing due to them being new so they see the $$ coming in hand over fist, so in their minds, they are doing everything right. Give it 3 or 4 months, when the phone doesn't ring as often, and a lot of guys do not call them back, and they will either quit or they will start spamming the ad section thinking that is the problem, or they will get a clue and realize that there are a number of things that make this a business not a party, and will take the steps they need to do. That might be a price drop, or an attitude change, or the ability to screen so they aren't saying yes to everyone, particularily people they may not click with. Also they may just be wary and nervous on first visits, and it is not a reflection of what they would be like on 2nd or 3rds.

Really? I am completely surprised why anyone would consider a GFE Massage ad to end in FS at all. I would think that it was clearly a term for how the massage (as in happy ending) will progress. If that is the case, then a lot of massage providers should be very careful of using the term ever. But like I say, the term GFE was an addon with an extra charge to full service sessions. For some reason, that information might be lost on newer clients perhaps? i would think anyone who was around when it was first brought up as the extra charge add on for extra services would recognize that it specifically refers to activities not including FS, like the kissing, daty, etc that were not previously available from sps. I just don't see any reason to reinterpret what is already been interpreted. Just as sps can't switcheroo what GFE actually is supposed to refer to (at minimum kissing, and anyone who doesn't do at least that should not be using GFE)

I offer 45 minutes, i think a lot of guys would like that option. it is a nice amount of time for someone who really does need a little less pressure to finish. but the half hour is ideal for someone who has an hour to get here and get back to where they should be, or to stop in on their way to something else. a half hour break is easily explained, an hour plus commute time not so much. I find it more than adequate for the majority of guys, and it isn't rushed if the prelude is massage with conversation.

I think we will have to disagree a bit here. It is my opinion that a sensual massage should already include things like being enthusiastic, caring and sensual, or slower paced, and friendly etc. So using a term like GFE would not or should not indicate only that aspect because it seems to me that it is something 'extra' in FS sessions, so why not in MA sessions. Here, I think most agree that if someone advertises a GFE massage session, it is because it includes everything in a GFE sp/FS session, but not the FS part. It is ideal for someone who can't for some reason perform intercourse, but still wants everything else. Like FS GFE, it is interpreted as at least kissing, and usually daty and the option of a bj (covered or not). I wouldn't even say that it includes body slide activity, because that would also be something that a sensual massage provider would include. You can still have the clear distinction between MA and SP, but I do think the term for GFE (I do agree it is over used) can be used with massage to indicate the standards of GFE that have always been associated with it: kissing, daty, bj.

If the rate is too high, then book a shorter session. I get weary of hearing complaints about hourly rates, when both sps and clients could simply get at least a little creative and do something with lower rates not by reducing the hourly rate, by by offering different services, and shorter sessions Additional Comments: re: 20 times the average wage. Personally that is a laugh because I am available 7 days a week between 9am and 11pm,. My hourly rate is pretty low when you consider that is what I need to do in order to get the appts that I do get. most sps have to be quite flexible with their times and schedules, and usually or often at the cost of a personal life for the time they do this. If someone is 'on call' in other jobs, do they consider that just because they didn't get called in that they weren't 'working'? No matter what the rates are, there are always going to be a small group of clients who resent the sps for charging anything at all. But that is the nature of this, that it is actually a business. Gouging is the word I think most find disagreeable,. I don't see the point of using a word like that. It isn't like this is the price of food or gas or anything, you can choose not to use the 'product' and pay the fees. I would also like to point out that phrase "hard earned money". I see it a lot on review sites. There is somehow linked to an unspoken assumption that an sp's income is not 'hard earned'. The last text I received was one word: "Die". Look at the post 3 above mine, and see what Deeper has had to put up with simply for advertising and providing her services. Maybe take a moment to think about whether or not the client's money is earned 'harder' than the sps' is.

This does sum things up nicely, and I also don't require references. It isn't necessary for how I screen or how I do my own bookings, etc. I also agree that if other sps do require references, that is cool, I understand there are a few reasons. For me personally, the safety issue seems to be paramount when the discussion comes up, but to me that is the least of the reasons for references. For one thing, like getting a phone call from an unblocked # versus a blocked one it sets up a false sense of security on that issue. To me, compatibility and our conversation help me decide if I am going to see a new caller or not. I wouldn't ask for references, nor will it be that important to me if he has them. HOWEVER, I would never, if asked, refuse to give one to another sp if the client contacted me and asked if I could do that. I would NEVER consider that what I do is all the work for those reference requiring sps so that they can have a safe encounter. But then I don't really consider that 'safety' is the number one issue for needing references, and I assume that at least half of the most important reason is elimination of time wasters. And that is important to everyone, imo. Just because some sps require references, and some don't, doesn't make either one better than the other. As one client points out, an sp's refusal to provide them takes her off his list. Her not requesting them at all puts her on someone else's list.

Good for you. You did a great job of representing the clients, imo. :)

I've got some good regular clients actually by simply replying to what anyone might consider rude or haggling by being firm and straightforward with them. I put hours not just in my ad, but right next to the phone #. You can't not see it. And yet, when the ad gets auto reposted at 12:30am, I do get phone calls at 1 and 2 am. I don't answer them, of course. If someone is calling without reading the hours, I know they are calling without reading my age and stats, and that is the real waste of my time. I also put my stats, age, etc, right under the phone #. These two things help filter out a few callers. It will never filter out all of them, but those guys will find ads anywhere and do the same thing. One site isn't the source of all the bad clients, just as one site isn't the source of all the bad sps. When I started I had a one line newspaper ad, and of course you get a lot of phone calls that don't lead to anything because the caller doesn't have enough info in those ads. You get 50 phone calls in a day, and maybe maybe 5 of them come by. But probably only one or two of those 5 come by a 2nd or 3rd time. Is that a waste of time? Answering 50 phone calls to get 5 appts and 2 regs? I don't think so, and I don't think many people running a business would think that either. If anyone expects that each and every call or enquiry is supposed to lead to an appt, I have a newsflash for them lol.

You are right about that. Any client these days that wants to see a wide variety of different sps, is going to have to eventually get on the reference band wagon. Some will need them some won't. It isn't always about safety, it is also about not having their time wasted and not losing $$ in order to set up something with a time waster. Some sps do not require references because they do not have to put other things aside or pay out of pocket to set up appts, and they do not allow long advance notice prebookings. It should be noted that sps who do want references provided only need it one time for each client who wants to book an appt. It isn't necessary to provide them for additional appts lol. Sometimes I get the feeling that it is such a burden of time and energy that it cannot possibly be done by some guys the way they react to the idea.

I remember on one site you can't use 'snow', and I'm in a place where snow on the ground is a rarity and I think we all wanted to refer to it in our ads or titles that day. The same site would allow a close up picture of someone's anus, but not the word snow.

All of these alternatives are not only available but being used by groups who do work with SWs, and are used by SWs, but you seem to think that that is the only thing that puts them working on the street rather than sit at home waiting for a phone call. They won't do what people want them to do, so they want LE to force them to do it. I deal with reality. LE has been forcing them to do what the NIMBY's want for the past 30 years, and at the end of every day, the SWs are always still out there. What exactly do you want them to do? It isn't illegal for them to stand outside of a building. It isn't illegal for them to exchange $ for sexual services. LE are already enforcing the existing laws. And in places where there are no such laws, the SWs are still out there. In places where everything is done to make sure that no one has to go to the street, the SWs are still out there. And people who are actively stalking them and pulling them inside, and trying to force them to work the way they want them to work are failing daily and miserably. Because just like you can't force people to drive the speed limit or not get behind the wheel of their car after 3 drinks, you can't force the SWs to work the way that works for you. I don't want to live in a society that thinks that some people should be harnessed, corralled, and shoved around simply because a small percentage of their customers are idiots. A small percentage of indoor worker's clients are also idiots. And again, I don't appreciate having what I said reworked: the SW used to have enough time to size up a client, to reduce her risk. The indoor worker does have this opportunity before the client even gets to the door. I would like the SW to have the same opportunity to be able to work safer. I don't think that includes harrassing her good customers, which will only leave her with the bad ones.

Even if there are issues with this, it doesn't mean that there can be no orgasm. It just means there won't be any FS to cum. And this can happen at 50 or 80, and some 80 year olds have no issue and some 50 year olds are on the kind of meds that create ED. And those guys just come to see a massage provider rather than going for FS appts, because you can still get there, you just do it in a different way. Age of providers do range, but I do notice that there are fewer sps in the over 40 category than the ones under 25. And that's ok, because there are fewer clients seeking the 40+, so there are enough of us to go around without a need to be fiercely competitive for a smaller pool of clients. (at least that is the case for most of us lol) The main thing is to embrace your sexuality at any age. The majority of my over 65 crowd only want to see sps who are over 40. I've had a few callers who have said I was too young, as they wanted to see someone in her 50's, and at the time I think I'd only even seen one single advertiser at 50.

I guess I just do not agree that street prostitution in and of itself causes problems. I think that street drug use, street gangs, street alcoholics, street homeless beggars, and street drug selling causes more problems, and has more of a social impact on the neighbourhood than a couple of ladies standing on a corner waiting for a ride. I think that, if you check the links regarding SW interviews, that the SWs receive far more problems from doing it (as in having garbage thrown at them by passing cars, along with insults, and along with the occasional bad date) than the neighbourhood suffers from them being there. For the past 30 years public solicitation has been illegal and LE has had the full force of the law behind them to crack down on SWs and their clients. And yet year after year, and sting after sting, and charge after charge, they are still out there. Because it doesn't work, none of those laws 'work'. None of those laws will ever work. It's time to use a harm reduction and real alternative solution to what people perceive to be the problem with SWs and their clients. Their clients are no more or less likely to be violent or problematic than an indoor workers clients, but the indoor worker has the benefit of being in a safe place when she answers the call, she has the benefit of talking to the guy prior to being in close contact with him, and she has the privileged position of just saying no. By the time most SWs are in a position of finding even half of that out about their clients, they have already driven away with them. The public solicitation laws and the enforcement and push back of the SWs has increased their danger, and increased the illusion the public has that they are not worthy. One thing Swedish SWs say is that due to the criminalization of their clients that they face far more risks in the work than before. That is a hard line crack down approach: reduced the clients in great numbers. But the SWs are still there, now working under a lot more duress and stress and much more vulnerable, and that is the result of the crack down laws. Before the crackdown laws the ladies had time to size up a client, they don't have that option now. And keeping in mind that a major number of SWs have other issues that drive them, like mental illness or addictions. After many years of being pushed around and charged and arrested by LE, that is the last place they go to when in trouble. These ladies don't have celphones and computers, and they don't have a place to bring clients (well, there are a couple of places now set up in Vancouver that does allow that by simply not forbidding it), and car dates really are their only solution. These are not the women guys are calling up to come and do an outcall to their hotel or home, and even if they did, these women would have no means of getting there anyway. We are talking about the 20-40 dates, not 200-400 :)

We have to go back to the main reasons why the laws were created in the first place (in the 80"s, remember, the majority of services were either street or agency (with some massage parlours of course). There weren't other venues for working. Just because someone is now or continues to do street work doesn't change the fact that that is the number one way it used to be done. For some of them, that is the only way they know how to work, and for them now they are 20-30 years older as well from when they started and it used to be easier. So the law is 100% about reducing the nuisance and NIMBY, because the laws were 100% about getting the street workers out of sight, off the downtown intersections, away from the front of the fancy hotels, and the best way to do that was with the no public solicitation laws brought in. So the indoor workers are rarely targeted because the laws were never intended to target them. They always wanted to get rid of the 'problem' which was and is whatever they can see. They could have just have easily dealt with street workers with anti loitering laws, and no stopping anytime signs, in the high traffic areas, but they wanted to be able to arrest them for what they were actually doing. Or at least move them on. They could care less about what that single mother can't afford for her kids. In Vancouver http://bccec.wordpress.com/tag/safe-sex-work-space/ http://bccec.files.wordpress.com/2010/01/final-report-violence_and_domestic_trafficking_bccew.pdf But I don't understand is while there is a definite stigma against street work, why so many people think it will go away. In a complete decriminalized, and where prostitution is covered by all kinds of regulations including licensing and health regulations of New Zealand, which also has similar history, culture and laws as in Canada, the street work continues at the same level as it did before decriminalization. Some people think complete decrim and making it easier to work legally is the solution and cannot figure out why it doesn't. It doesn't because like the 15 minute quickie appt, sps provide the services that their clients are looking for. And some clients want 15 minute appts, but other clients want to drive down the street, have an SW jump in their car, negotiate, complete the date, and drop her off within 20 minutes of first seeing her there. We may not understand it, like we don't understand a client wanting to go to the trouble of making a 15 minute appt, or some clients don't understand the guys who would pay an sp to spend the night with them or go for dinner, but they do, all the time.

I might be wrong, but I think one of the main reasons is they believe that if they go to an sp incall, they will be assaulted and robbed by someone in the closet. Staying outdoors, only allowing a single SW into their vehicle, in spite of all of the things mentioned, they actually feel safer. Beyond that time and convenience and 'seeing what you get' factors in, along with an assumption the price will be lower and/or they do not go online and have no idea that sps advertise in any other way than to stand on the corner.

Vancouver is not agency driven, like some other cities. Your best bet is to look at ads and recos of the independents, and contact them directly.

I;m surprised Greyhound can't come in and do it. They already have some offices for parcel pickup, so the courier service trucks come and go. Not sure why they can't have a couple of revolving busses going from province to province even if it is not daily service. in fact I was surprised when I was doing some travel arrangements for a friend, looking at the options, and that wasn't an option at all. Seems very odd.

Very good points. And I find that they don't just not ask the underage worker, they assume the underage worker is working in exploitive conditions and/or coerced. We can't always make those assumptions, because I have spoken to a few sps who did work when under 18, and they had their own individual reasons to do that. Including just getting spending money for shopping and not really knowing what the heck they were doing. Another due to drug use, but the drugs came first, the sex work was to pay for the addiction. And there are few options outside of streetwork for the underage worker, too.

It's not the sex, it's the drugs they don't want their kids around. Because as they all know, sps are also buying (and I guess selling?) drugs to all these guys who come by at 3AM. Plus in order to pay the sp (and all those drugs), these guys (you guys) are breaking into their cars and apartments to steal stuff. Then they are loitering around, even if they've already seen the sp, for who knows what reason, because I don't know why they would be hanging around if they've already picked up/dropped off their drugs AND had their bjs.. :)