fortunateone

Another case of pay before play for the sp, as there are guys like this who will refuse to pay anything at all. And good for the hotel to have a policy of accepting the trade, with conditions lol.

I wanted to quote all this part for double emphasis (the whole post was great) but the final paragraph is so bang on. I call them review board bullies, fwiw, always trying to push, and intimidate and threaten to get sps to lower rates and increase riskier services to the point they are going to shoot themselves in the foot. The ones who get pushed end up getting pushed right out of the business, unwilling to work for cheaper doing more, and then where is that kind of guy? Looking for his next victim, or whining about how there are no quality providers left (in HIS price range). That's right, there are no quality providers willing to see him, in or out of his range. No one likes a bully.

A few ideas for getting media interested: Link it to the growing number of missing women in Winnipeg, the SWs who have been killed over the years, and the police inaction on that. I think I saw fairly recent stories on this topic. Mention that while people may not want an mp in their neighbourhood, maybe they also do not want a bunch of dead SWs either. Mps offer a safe and indoor location for people to go discretely and out of the public eye. Maybe mention the last time Winnipeg went to the trouble of shutting down a bawdy house set up, and went to court, and laid out charges, the only result was a slap on the wrist and a $2000 fine. Hardly worth the effort of destroying people's lives for something that didn't end the sex trade in Winnipeg. lnc, it is true they are a legal business, but they do not hold a bodyrub license, and providing sexual services of any kind is not legal. But yes they are being harrassed in a way that other health service businesses are not.

OK, the voice of doom, but before thinking to send a pic, regardless of where the camera is pointing, is be fully confident that the only person with access to the sp's account is the sp herself. And then also keep in mind that email accounts can and have been hacked, for a variety of reasons. And not every sp is trustworthy with personal information, sad to say. So just be aware of her good reputation before you provide too much information. I do not ask for a picture, and this is because how someone looks does not matter one bit to me. How they sound, how they treat me in conversation, and in person, that matters to me. Someone can send a picture of anyone's face (or dick), and it doesn't mean it is them. I have a healthy amount of paranoia or caution, and might see someone sending me pics as a flag of someone who is looking for a dating relationship or expects me to be overwhelmed by their hottedness and ask them to hang out with me for free. If I was doing incall in a house, or meeting someone outside in public, however, a picture would be ideal and really a nice gesture of trust.

Does he really think Toronto is the best place to get the kind of rates the Bunny Ranch claims to charge? I think part of his investigation might reveal that TO has amongst the lower rates for sps and so the clients will have a lower rate expectation, even in fancy surroundings. (not saying the rates are super low, just that if 250-300/hr is topping the higher rate now charged, then expectations of $2000 usually suggested on the show isn't very likely).

As long as you have an income, you need to file taxes. There is no magical cutoff amount, such as $12,000. I have helped someone prepare a tax return for an income based on $500/month, CRA accepted the return happily. Yes, you need to file to get that rebate set up as well, regardless of your income. The only way you can get a tax refund is if during the course of making that income, you paid taxes or had taxes witheld. Refunds come out of amounts already given to the government. There is an amount per year where you might end up with a negative net income, of course, after personal exemption is deducted. Most selfemployed business owners don't write themselves paycheques each month, so don't withold any tax amounts. So most people even with a ton of allowable expenses are going to end up owing a significant amount of money if there were no deductions or payments made thru the year. Rather than payout in one lump sum, I just pay out an estimated amount every month, and work it all out at the year end. That way if anything is still owing, it will be minimal I hope lol.

Well, outside or inside the city limits, the reason charges get laid is because it is illegal cross Canada, not just inside the city limits. Complaints can come from neighbours, disgruntled clients not getting their own way, and/or competing setups. Anything that leads to an investigation taking place. Oddly, I think it is rare that LE just looks at bp ads and starts their own investigating lol. In Van, LE pretty much has a harm reduction policy. It may be illegal to provide incall in hotel room or apartment, but if the alternate is being on the street or dangerous outcalls, they leave incall sps alone. The exception will be a 'shop' in an apartment, 24/7 clients coming and going, 'managers', multiple sps, and multiple clients coming in and out, and the rather ridiculous "going to the lobby to meet clients to escort them up" like no one will notice the same person go downstairds every 15-30 minutes to meet another man to take upstairs. Stuff gets noticed. People think 'drugs' and they don't want that next door to them, just as they don't want loud drunk guys coming and going at all times of the day.

Exactly. You can either pander to the picture collector or the client who can't make a move without seeing 6 dozen shots, with updates every 3 months, or the clients who are looking for more. I don't want to see the sort of client who needs frequent picture updates before they finally make a decision to see me. They seem to me to be very high maintenance, and I prefer a client who is easygoing and relaxed, or looking to relax. My advertising started in the papers, one line ads, then again all text with a bit more info. I prefer the clients who look for more than a naked crotch shot to make their decisions, to be a bit graphic. I put 3 pics into my ads, and get calls wanting more, or a face pic, or whatever and I will just blow them off. There is enough info already to invest a little time to knock on my door, someone who asks for more is unlikely to book appts, but they will contact you over and over again asking for more pics. There is a way to compromise. If you only have one picture, then a couple more of tasteful photos will not hurt, especially if your photo is out of date. Once you have 2-3 photos you are happy with, then anyone asking for more is sent to your ad or gallery, those are all there will ever be, and they will just have to be satisfied with that. Front, side, back, what more does anyone need? lol

I know with touring ladies it is more difficult to keep things in check, it is too bad that some people go to the lengths of making fake bookings. Also the ones who do a 'just in case' booking, equally bad. They set a time because they want to see the sp, but really have no idea whether or not they themselves will be free at that time. I would encourage people to not book in advance, but only ask if the lady will put them on a callback list, so she contacts them if she has an opening, then they book if they can. That way she will be free for other legit callers. For myself, I just don't allow prebooked appts. A regular or new client can always call in advance, give an ETA, but they will always always always have to go thru a same day process to confirm. I never rely on anyone saying they 'will' do something as many many many things can happen between Friday and Monday, including the inability to call to cancel. Considering I can still get no shows by guys who call within a half hour of ETA, book the appt at that time, and still not show up for an appt, you can understand what a game it is for some people. I cannot imagine doing a tour without requiring deposits and references. At least with myself, there is no cash outlay to get me to my location, and the time wasted is not more than 30-40 minutes.

There are many assumptions made about sps who choose to be DNR. I believe your experience is the normal, not the exception. You will hear much debate on the idea that an sp who is DNR is subpar and that is why they don't want reviews, but I know the reality is that they simply do not want reviews, and the reasons have nothing to do with that particular accusation. Some sps don't want discussion of any kind, including pms. But I think for the most part what they do not want is anything posted publically and actually might be OK with a pm exchange.

One good piece of advice I heard on a talk show once was: It takes 1000 'attaboys" to undo the damage of one mean spirited remark. It seems to be good advice. AM your friend would need to unlock lips and start finding things to praise and compliment about you in order to undo the damage of illplaced advice, imo. Being a non-confrontational person myself, what someone else might interpret as the typical passive=aggressive silent treatment might just be someone walking away from an argument, saying something they might regret later, and/or just how they learned to deal with anger or frustration. Different people are raised different ways. Sometimes you see it in a simple thing like a sneeze. Do you notice how some people say something and others do not? Are you ever surprised when someone does the thing you are not used to in your own family or circle? I know I am lol. And that is a simple thing. Perhaps your friend comes from a family where that silence was the typical way to deal with things. Sometimes it comes out of anger or resentment or a genuine belief that there is no point saying anything because the person you are talking to isn't listening. But if this is the way they deal with their own frustration, that is their issue, not yours. If they wish to retreat, let them. You don't have to chase after them, you don't have to pester them and give in to that whole dramatics deal. Just back away, do your thing, see what life is like without them around for a while. Eventually they will come back and wonder why you didn't chase after them this time. The only one you can control is yourself. That person isn't communicating? OH well, carry on and get on with your own life, imo..

This is like a huge un-story lol. Why didn't the reporter look into this, or quote the police as saying "this isn't a crime", and "what exactly do you expect us to investigate?" Instead they've chosen to make the police look incompetent, and sex work for 18 year olds illegal. Very poor job of it, if you ask me. And no investigation into where these callers are getting the number, it must be from some fairly current advertising. And the one call described obviously suggested there wasn't one sp with one picture, but an agency. Why else describe someone. This is a case of a reporter wanting a story and pretty much creating one out of nothing, lol.

I'd like to see remakes of the Thin Man, I have seen them a few times over. I also like Cary Grant movies, and really wish they had done an updated Philadelphia Story with George Clooney, Matt Perry (in Jimmy Stewart's role) and never had a good idea for the female lead. I know they would put whoever is popular that year in there, and that was not my preference lol

I know that when asked why they do this, or to justify why they do these sorts of reviews, one at least honestly said it was because he wants to 'relive' the moments. Actually I think I've read that a couple of times. And same two guys have to, again, justify their reviews, as others who try to see the same sps have actually walked away without staying, the reality was so far removed from the tale they had spun. I once asked one, if you bring a bag of stuff, and basically recreate the exact same repetitive routine with each new sp, how is that a good thing for you, for her, for anyone? She is another sp who is a good sport about having to try to do all those things, just as the next 25 he sees, all within 45 minutes and a cuddle at the end (or bad review will come), rather than simply allow yourself to be taken on a journey by this new sp her way, with her strengths and ideas. Try meeting each one as an individual and not a trained seal or blow up doll, and maybe start getting more out of these experiences worth sharing. I have heard this comment a few times, actually. The review comes out so incredibly different from reality. And the best an sp can hope for is quietly pm the guy and say, "um, I don't do bbbjs, you didn't get one, so maybe you can edit that part." And that is just one small thing. lol

I agreed with Gabriella. Really the best defense against this is for the client to contact the sp being given as a reference to expect to be contacted by sp-2 soon. I feel strongly that clients need to give their permission to sp-1 before she can just pass on anything about the client. Sure the majority of the time everything is on the up and up. Maybe the two sps know each other, and consider the information in safe hands. But what if it is the case of some unknown supposedly new sp doing the contacting, the client has not verified he is seeking a reference from sp-2, and sp-2 goes ahead and confirms having met him. And what if this new sp is not an sp, but an SO or some other person in his life out to make trouble. Now, unbeknownst to him, sp-2 has just confirmed he has seen her, and recently, and frequently possibly. So really, if sp-1 needs a reference, as a client please advise the sp you are using as a reference the full details of who will be contacting her. And if sps don't get this heads up, then please contact your client to ask if he is requesting a reference. And please please please, for the safety of everyone but only if you plan to be helpful to fellow sps and be open to the idea of giving references, start keeping good records somewhere or somehow. Any other business person would do this, it helps you remember who you have seen, it helps you accomodate to their needs when you see them again, it also prevents the total time wasters from wasting your time over and over again. It just makes sense. Not doing that, not remembering info about people you see, or have seen you, that just might backfire on you one day. Not keeping some information about the people who come to see you or you go to see and god forbid something goes wrong, how exactly is someone going to be able to investigate anything about it. It is ok to say publically that you don't, god knows there is a lot of paranoia out there about someone even getting a fake phone #, but this is a lot bigger than one nervous nelly.

Or also that in her opinion, there had been no signs for 24 hours, or so, and she would believe it was completely done. However, condom in and out, and unexpectedly not completely done. Also there is spotting for some which can certainly happen any time and without warning. If this was an agency sp, also, like it or not, her bailing on short notice could not just cost her the appt fee, but she could have been fined by the agency, meaning missing the appt literally would cost her money. Not an easy choice, but doing the appt, the best of two bad options. It's not an exact science. And, it actually, imo, isn't something that needs to be discussed in a review, if that was considered, or pm, as it is unlikely she didn't notice (and possibly mortified)

My education got me a couple of opportunities that were not given to others who were working at the same locations. In both situations, it was my opinion that those others should have gotten the position not myself, because they had the actual hands on experience that would have been much more of benefit to the job and the company. But those people didn't have some piece of paper so they didn't. Ridiculous. Companies prefer to hire outsiders with the diplomas, rather than promote more qualified applicants who've shown years of loyalty and ability, which is just wrong. I have no idea why you have encountered clients that want to quiz you on your education. It is incredibly rude of them, and I think that if they'd done that with me, then turn around and book another appt, I would pass lol. Maybe they want to feel superior, maybe they just want to prove an assumption that all sps are sps because they don't have degrees, and therefore can't do anything else. It is insulting whether you have one or not, to have people assume we are incapable of doing anything else. It is also insulting for them to suggest that having one makes one person superior over another. Some people don't do well in school settings. A large number of high IQ people do not do well in school settings. School can be incredibly boring if you are bright or advanced. There are all kinds of ways to be smart. One way is not insult the person you want to get intimate with. My dad was the smartest person I know, and his last formal schooling was grade 9. He read all the time, everything, 'smart' books lol. History, politics, biographies, etc. He was over 50 when he got his GED, and in the meantime, further education in his field (a trade, not a degree) There isn't anything wrong with not having a diploma or degree, or not attending university if it is not your path. There are many ways to learn and grow and contribute and participate, in the world. All you need to do, with clients, is be able to hold your own in conversations, and I would hope that quantum physics or Shakespeare isn't part of general chit chat during a massage or even dinner.

I am jumping to the reply before reading all the other posts, which is unusual for me. I don't think wearing fur is different than wearing leather or eating meat for that matter. Having said that I don't wear fur, leather or eat meat, so there you go. I would rather there was no fur, leather or meat (as in cow and pig meat, among other furry four legged critters), but I am not a zealot on the topic. I do think that leather is dumb to wear, so uncomfortable regardless of what is made out of it other than shoes I guess. But fur can be very beautiful.

For some reason I get the impression you have already decided that 'since it's only an escort, then I am not responsible ..." If you get any woman pregnant, and a baby appears, regardless of what she does for work, the laws are the same. I think the only legal way to absolve your sperm from parental responsibility is donating via sperm bank. There must be some kind of release form that protects you from child support claims. * The only reason I am replying at all to this is that is seems to be a common fantasy by some that an sp who may accidentally become pregnant. I don't know many sps who don't have a method of birth control, or, should there be a condom mishap, wouldn't automatically go in for a morning after pill to ensure there would be no pregnancy. If all of that fails, then why , if such a thing has ever happened, wouldn't she simply get an abortion? And if that didn't happen, how, 9 months later, is she supposed to be able to get ahold of all the clients who may be the father in for DNA testing, and have them cooperate? And after all that, supposedly is going to be able to collect child support from that one, apparently, unlucky guy. I ask because there are so many single mothers unable to get their ex-SOs to cough up child support, so how is she going to manage to get a virtual stranger to do it?

I can now say that I have heard everything, because last week someone called me up specifically saying this is what he had in mind. He saw I advertise 'women welcome' which men men interpret as 'couples welcome", which is not correct. He figures I would be willing to teach her to do bjs. I told him if he ever wanted a bj, or sex in general, from his wife in his lifetime again, he had better not take her to an sp thinking it is a 3some, and telling her it was sex ed for her poor bj skills. Additional Comments: You might be happy to know that a lot of guys who do come to see sps feel very comfortable asking for instructions. I think the nature of these encounters, different from dating or the lack of communication in relationships, people can open up to simply asking about techniques or ideas. Even the embarrassment of PE or ED can be dealt with much more comfortably seeing an sp rather than avoiding contact with other women because of these issues. It opens up a lot of opportunity for dialogue, and most sps do not advertise instruction as a service, yet do it often.

I think the shiney ones are nice, but since they don't work in parking meters or pay phones, they just aren't useful. I can have 25 coins in my pocket but if 20 are pennies, I can get a ticket for not being able to put enough time in the meter to get thru the bank lineup. I think rounding up or down, it is just going to be like how taxes have been calculated at the cash register. There is a formula of rounding up and down, it will no doubt have to work the same way. Not always up and not always down.

This is a good point. There is already lots of opportunities for those clients who are only interested in cost, and could care less who is providing the service as long as it is cheap. Usually they also go along with the bait/switch or unique advertising that comes along with this. But the majority of clients, in my and many other sps experiences, are not just interested in price and checklists. They want to see specific people. Having a lowest price guarantee is pretty meaningless to them. And for those where that is the only important issue, there are plenty of agencies that have one set price system. It is the sort of business that thrives on selection and variety, not uniformity and standardizations.. I cannot think of one single story in the countries that have decriminalized and regulated sex work itself where the individual sps don't have the same sort of work choices they had before. They simply have the ability to work like any other industry, with support instead of on the edge of legality. Street workers still work on the street, agency workers still work via agencies, indies still work out of their own space, and so on. Even the assumption that every sp will have to get a license has not been enforced in newly decriminalized and regulated countries. And even those who open brothels have to be clean of criminal history. Now, who is stopping anyone from opening an escort agency or massage parlour? If you decriminalize work spaces, then you open the door to the kinds of regulations that require criminal background checks of agency owners or massage parlour operators. I think the city of Toronto doesn't even require agencies to have business licenses right now.

Dear backrubman, There are already a number of sites that do this already. Including, to a certain extent, this one. preferred411, date-check, verifyhim, etc etc charge fees, clients can register with their private details thru the site, get verified, and book with ease using only a reference name or number. The sps on the site have access to prescreened clientele. However, that, like any clients who know about review sites or escort forums, is such a teeny tiny fraction of the entire client pool out there, it is one of those things nice in theory, and not viable in reality. The reality is that many guys refuse to divulge personal details to a 3rd party. Another is they will choose to see street workers or walk into massage parlours rather than even divulge their phone #, let alone anything else. Sps who want someone else to handle every aspect of their marketing and booking, and there are oodles of them, will always work with agencies or at massage parlours. Sps who grow tired of being sent to anyone with a wallet, go independent and decide for themselves who to see. And also, if they start to dislike the cut the agency takes. Nothing in the decriminalization will change any of this, imo. It is unlikely that anything other than the majority of sps who work from home will now no longer fear the next knock on the door is LE shutting down their illegal incall. I definitely don't see any link between decrim and rates. I also am fairly convinced there is no link between decrim and any increase in new sps. And going into the priceline, pay by CC, etc etc, well just go back to my comments about how much detail most clients are willing to provide. They are not willing to provide to the sp or a 3rd party, in the majority, full name, address, CC info, expiry date and 3 digit pin, just to secure an appt with most sps. And even if there was an enterprising person out there to come up with that idea, do you have any idea at how few sps would have anything to do with it? If an sp is indy, she is indy all the way. NO one is going to get between her and her level of what is considered enough or reasonable screening. NO one is going to take an additional fee to process CCs, or any other consideration. I am at a loss in general as to why or how so many people come up with so many elaborate ideas about the results of decriminalizing the bawdy house law, and the living off the avails. I think there is this assumption about thousands of people sitting around waiting for the opportunity to become sex workers, or work for one, or build and open brothels, and oh but for the sake of those two little laws, they would have done it 25 years ago. There weren't any brothels built 25 years ago before these laws were created. There were no bawdy house laws, no living off the avails, no laws against public solicitation. So why weren't there any brothels? Why no priceline set up for prostitutues? Why did sps work for agencies, and mpas go to work at massage parlours. Why did sps rent hotel rooms instead of setting up their own incall in the privacy of their own home? Lots of things to consider, but also to get a bit of perspective as well.

I agree, and without being too open about things, massage parlours outside of Ontario always offer more than R&T. It doesn't mean the MAs in mps are going to be open to doing more, or that the clients who go there necessarily want more. If they wanted more, they wouldn't be at an Ontario mp, they would visit an independent or agency sp.

^^ you have a point. Edmonton (and Calgary?) have already taken steps to revise their massage parlour/licensing laws, I think it is discussed elsewhere. Vancouver has also announced they will be doing something similar. I think these municipalities were looking at these issues in terms of pretty much assuming the laws would be struck down, and that at some point they should be proactive in licensing to allow for the changes. I cannot see the federal government doing anything noticeably good unless/until they are forced to. That way it is out of their hands and they will not be seen to be promoting or supporting prostitution, simply following their legal obligations, or I suppose the laws being struck down, will show up and now be able to say they can't do anything about it, so sad. That way they don't have to be seen as responsible for the downfall of society by allowing prostitutes to work from home.