fortunateone

I think along the lines of Kyra, to say that there is a list of items that the sp does, and some clients will go in expecting to have each and every one of them. To do this might end up being a real scripted session (i.e. first a kiss, then a bjs, onto daty, onto mpos, etc etc) rather than the possibility that the natural flow means no daty, or massage or so on and so on. The easiest one to view is in the case of a bbbj being on the list, and this one may or may not happen either because it is a first visit, the hygiene is not there, or she is in general moving away from bbbjs but has not taken it off the menu, or she might only do a bbbj after visual inspection, etc. Some sps want to do away with listing acronyms at all, as they feel stuck into the options and away from the total experience. I am not sure that is a great idea, but I do agree that a certain segment of clients look for a list before they look for an sp they are going to be compatible with or may have a better time with. The absence or presence of a bbbj is far more important to them, in other words, and if the bbbj comes with a ymmv they are likely to pass.

I know, and they often use as an excuse that they are not permitted (by law) to discuss services, which is not true. If they don't have services somewhere else, I usually advise anyone (especially new) to avoid this type of sp. If she has a review that mentions the services, fine. I think agencies are hard to deal with too, often they don't know what the sps do or don't do, or it may take too long to find out, so suddenly the sp does everything (not true), and the client and sp are put in a bad place.

I would say Belize. The climate of Costa Rica, in English. Also Puerto Escondido (Mexico) is nice this time of year, not too busy, nice Mexican tourist place (i.e. not filled with resorts and all inclusives, but actually where Mexicans families go for vacation) Shenzhen/ in China. It is actually a cheap roundtrip flight (well, from vancovuer anyways) and really really inexpensive to stay there. Very close to Hong Kong, if you wanted to check flight rates for there, then take a taxi or ferry over to Shenzhen. It is on the water, there is a Seaworld park with a hotel there near the ferry, then into the city area I guess you call it, lots of things to see. The weather is warmer this time of year. There is a theme park i think called wonders of the world, with smaller versions of a bunch of stuff like Niagra Falls, The Eiffel Tower, etc. Really odd and sounds like fun. Cheap stuff to buy, cheap to stay at basic hotels with breakfasts included. I think it is a clear winner for a trip. The Expo is in Shanghai this year, not too far away, but I don't know when. Apparently in Shanghai in october is some sort of prawn time (some kind of seafood lol, a really big event whatever it is).

I can't think of anything that cannot be discussed on the phone, though. All services and rates for the services can be discussed, so the only thing really that might rub the sp the wrong way is being overly graphic, rude or aggressive in some way. I have not encountered very many shy guys who are capable of any of that kind of behaviour. If an sp is offended someone needs to ask about rates even though she doesn't mention them anywhere, oh well. Move on, cuz clearly she is in the wrong business lol. Also part of the biz is talking about them with a potential client in spite of the fact they are available on site or in an ad. Most guys have learned that what is written can be out the window when he shows up, so a verbal (or email) confirmation on a direct question coming directly to him is a great business tool. He can be much more at ease that nothing will change between hanging up the phone and showing up at her door. Most of the things in this business come about because of the things others do wrong. So when an sp gets paid in full at the beginning of the session, that is due to the small # of guys who plan to rip off sps. When a client asks specifically about rates & services, even if they can be found on a website, that is because a small # of sps (or often agencies) lie about what is available or what the real rates are. Unfortunate, but dealing with this in an up front manner puts everyone on the same page. I think the OP should give us a clear example of what cause the ruckus from the sp.

I found it helpful to spend some time reading thru several pages of threads and posts, gets a better sense of who is who. Make a note of their handle and join date, # of posts, etc. Reading thru the past few months of threads (if they are very old threads, don't bump them up tho), gives you an idea of current topics of discussion. It helps the newbie avoid the classic fail of posting a thread they think is completely new to everyone, but it was beaten to death in mid July lol. When I log into any site, I always click on New Posts. This way I don't miss any updates to threads I am following, or new threads that might be of interest. When you see a topic you have an opinion on, even to just say you agree with a post, go on ahead.

It is a very bad way to do business, and either she was in it for the short term or she understandably had to either bury that persona or quit. This kind of practise (in Canada) is very unusual, I think you may never encounter such a thing again, not because you learned a valuable lesson, but because this kind of thing is so unusual this is the first time I have ever heard someone actually doing this. Maybe she was American and did it american style (all the hedging around to give out the info) but standard practise is to get paid up front, so someone who chooses payment after, meets first in public, etc, that is just odd and (imo) a huge red flag of do not do that.

It is definitely only going to affect the US city sites. CL admin are vehemently against the efforst of these state AGs and have been in and out of court to get them off its back, as far as I can tell from last year when they implemented the payment system. The paid ad is now being used against them, as the newsreporters love to mention how much CL makes on these ads, when the measure was brought in as a direct result of the legal threats lol. So they pay people to screen the ads, and payment cuts down on the numbers, and the excess $$ is used for charitable organizations, but no one ever wants to mention where the money going, just how much there is. If there had been no complaints or legal threats, CL would continue to happily make no money on the erotic services ads. I think allowing the AG threats to change how they did things actually opened them up to more legal headaches. Making money on the ads now can be viewed as profiting from them, whereas before no one could make that statement. So, in order to try to address the complaints, that led to more complaints. Lose lose. CL has always been firmly against having paid ads on their sites, or allowing big governement to come in and try to control them. They are very San Francisco. It was supposed to be an alternative to pay sites, to allow everyone free access and opportunities, and that does continue to be their main purpose. It is a shame that they can't do that in their own country, but maybe as lawsuits continue, they may get it finally resolved thru federal courts like that last story you mentioned.

Low lighting. I have 3 nightlight types, flip the blinds to almost closed if it is daylight outside, a colourful scarf draped across half ot the window, and half a dozen or so candles. Also candles at the front door and a couple of nightlights for the hallway. NO direct or bright lights at all. I like to create a warmer and cosy atmosphere, to separate from the outside world, with scents and mellow music for a more sensuous experience. If I was more action oriented or pse or similar, there would be more lights and noise lol.

I DISLIKE ADS IN ALL CAPS. Or with numbers spelled out. i have seen some where I am sure guys throw up their hands and say shat the heck is she trying to spell out? 3065 or 365 or ??? Anything tryiing to get all fancy with a lot of ** or ^ or squiggly lines etc. If you see a title copied into a review or maybe they use the same ad on a review forum, then the short version of the title is nothing but symbols. Any ads that use "barely legal". To me, that means either she is too inexperienced to have proper safety checks (and is setting herself up for danger) or she is actually under age (under 18). Ads that imply an 18-19 year old is so sexually sophisticated she is able to offer greek, PSE standbys like bbbjs/CIM/COF and she is making that choice for herself only after researching the health risks. To me, anyone with these kinds of ads implies she is being aggressively managed. I simply don't buy that an 18 year old with no history of sex work is capable ofmaking that decision, or is able to perform up to the level expected of them if they are advertised that way for all clients, older and younger, in other words.

That is my view too. CL in their blog is quite vocal about how they cooperate, and that their discussions with NGOs working on underage and trafficking issues are actually aided by having such a popular site used by these predators. The account system, the CC payment, the ease of posting ads, and the popularity of the site draws in these people, and LE can actually use it to their advantage. With this section gone, these people will still be offering the same things, but it is going to be much harder to figure out who and where. The advertisers will be using the casual encounters and the therapuetic sections, or they are going to be using a variety of other sites and venues, which are not monitored as well as CL was doing. The problem is the issues will continue with or without CL, just as they existed prior to CL. Now how easy is it going to be to find these people?

I just thought the statement was bare, and open to interpretation, which many did take to be a nosethumbing statement lol. Had the OP said that advertising on EC was not an option for her right now due to limited schedule and finances, then there would have been no such speculation. And when I said pm is best, I imagined it was because by this point you would have had some history of corresponding (i.e. getting to "know") with othe sps and they would be the ones to ask about vouching. I certainly did not imagine that you would need to pm to all the sps on the site, and if you haven't built any rapport or friendliness with anyone yet, then you might like to take the time to do so. No one imagines that you can meet face to face anyone -- I certainly haven't but I have had the pleasure of exchanging personal stories, pms and emails with a variety of sps here, which is a pleasure and the main reason for my being here. I live on the other side of the country, btw.

I would suggest connecting with any local agency to get you started. There are independents, but alot of them started out with a couple of major agencies (those with incall/mp locations) at first. These places also send out on outcalls, but I think what happens often there is that the clients stick to an agency to connect with, because they feel a better amount of reliability with them? In any case, if you lack an incall, connecting with someone like SweetVIPs which encourages independents & you can have a win-win situation by working with a large client list, having an incall location available, and still doing it on your own with outcalls. I definitely am not recommending SweetVIPs over anyone else; in fact, I am not a fan of her advertising style and promotion gimmicks, but when you are going to a town with an established routine, it doesn't hurt to get to know someone in advance that might want to work with you until you get yourself established. Also available is priceplatinum, which rents out an incall location. Details and contact info, I have no idea, but you can google or maybe either one have ads here?

First I thought she was new, but I see she has over 500 posts. L, surely you have 'met' a few people by this time, you have been a member since Feb this year and have posted quite a bit so far, so perhaps the advice to pm someone should be followed at this time. :D

Yes, plus the style and tone of the ad itself first attracts the type of gentleman desired. I am sure we have all seen ads that lack this quality on sites other than CL? I don't think you would look at such an ad, regardless of where you see it, and think, "hey, there's a classy upscale lady",, and yet regardless of the location of my ads, I hear that alot. But if you hear enough people say the same derogatory comments about the people who use it (both clients and sps), there are going to be alot of people who start to believe it. And frankly, it is not logical. For one thing, the loudest detractors claim to never use the site. Then how am I to believe they have any idea about the ladies who advertise there, or the clients who use it? These sweeiping generalizatioons are misleading and scaremongering, and it really is offensive to many of us who use it to be swept along with such false accusations. Additional Comments: Pre internet days there were two ways to see escorts: the street view and an agency. The agency had ads in the papers and yellow pages,impossibly for an independent girl. The independents had very little options other than the sidewalk to "advertise". SWs are not (or did not use to be) all low rate car date encounters. SPs are very spoiled these days lol, able to advertise, have phone or emails to set up appts, work indoors, and so on. I do not see CL responsible for the issues going on in the industry, because these same issues have been going on for decades. The most infamous sps are the high track girls in Vancouver. Well known for super high prices, and really low service, including one shot is the goal so for 400-500 bucks you can spend 20 minutes with one of the hottest young women you have ever seen ... who won't let you touch, kiss or daty her. This was pre-internet days 10 years, 15 years, 20 years ago. Are there low rate sps advertising on CL? Yes, because there are low rate sps in each and every city. These desperate ladies used to stand outdoors as well,, but nowhere near those high track hotties, because there is no way they can get 100, let alone 500 from a date. I place newspaper ads. I have for almost 10 years, again, before the prevalence of internet advertising of ANY kind. One advertiser was pulled because she and her two friends ran a "my friend needs my help, plus my boyfriend just arrived, and he wants you out now" scam. She paid almost 200 bucks a month to run this scam lol. Now I suppose she posts online ads to do the same thing. My point is that CL is a symptom, not the problem. Any of the sps that take advantage of such a site would simply have done the same things thru other means. The difference these days is they are exposed much faster, and more people are more asware of them than they ever were before. Guys are realizing that this sort of thing is not supposed to happen, and are able to be more cautious and wiser. And that is completely new. Annessa's description of the typical client is totally correct. I was about to mention that I know of an older sp who has been doing this for a few years. What happens with some of these sorts of ladies is these sorts of sites are very intimidating. They can manage to post an ad or two on CL, but navigating a more complicated site, with discussion areas and perplexing decisions about where to place their ad, or the idea of coming on to check and send pms is just not worth it to them. Usually they find the existing members intimidating, and are afraid to break any rules. Many guys I see don't go online at all (paper ad clients) and have zero interest in using them. I am sure there are many sps who advertise where I do who feel the same way. Basically what I would like to see is a little understanding of the economics behind these choices (for the sps) and less misinformation. If you don't use it, fine, but don't pass judgment on something that you know nothing about.

Sorry I do have to agree with Tulsa here (not sorry I am agreeing but that it does seem to be a dig at mod, which is not my intent). I and other CL advertisers have attempted time and again to explain the rationale behind using CL. It is not entirely because it is free. It is because it gets the traffic, which brings the clients, which, in the end for the ladies East of me, enables them to pay for advertising on more focused sites like EC, cerb, etc. Would you really deny these sps access to this site because we actually need to make a living at this, and frankly the only way this is going to happen is by using ALL the tools available to us. I use another free site (and have utilized free ad offers from various sites that have come and gone) and can honestly say that I have NEVER had one client from those other sites. I do pay for advertising in a newspaper/online that is more appropriate to my location and servies, and that costs me far more than most online advertising -- but I can pay them in cash, and not use CC or other online payment methods which suits me. I currently spend over $250 a month on ads, and post daily ads on CL, and the majority of my clients (who are ALL GREAT HONEST AND GENUINELY NICE GUYS) come from CL not my paid ads. The OP had resources available, was given tips for choosing first sps, and probably oodles of suggestions, yet still thought he knew best and went ahead and did everything wrong. It had nothing to do with choosing someone on CL, because I hear the same stories from guys who make their first mistakes choosing to go to a micro, an asian massage parlour, or use an agency instead of an independent. And the scammers, many of them, when they pop up on CL vancouver ARE FROM AGENCIES lo;. So yes, Tulsa is again correct when she says that this sort of sp/advertiser will alays find a way to find clients. If CL was not there, then they would simplhy be elsewhere. It is buyer beware, at all times. For even a great sp can be a bad time for a guy who is really looking for all the things she does not provide, and ends up thinking she is a lousy sp when the reality is he did not ask about the things he wanted.

A lot of experienced sps do take scheduled time off during the summer months. Or at least a more limited availability, in order to take advantage of the weather! At the very least, the days you do work will be busier than if you are just ready as per usual. I think the mod is fairly accurate about the usual slower times. The no show thing tho, I can guarantee that most sps already use some sort of verification, and the same thing is happening. (most do not accept block call appts, so the # is for sure there). The best thing to do is to limit the info given re: address. Give out a general area, then the street address when they get there, then when they are at the street address, the rest. that way you don't waste too much time and energy giving out full address info to someone who may or may not arrive, and who has to travel 30-45 minutes to get there too. You allow the time wasters too much power over your schedule if you give out too much too soon. Time wasters are very common -- they collect addresses, they try to book you for times with no intention of showing up (possibly in order to make their fav sp the one guys go to see because you are busy. Just don't give anyone the power to waste more than about 30 minutes of your time, and always offer the next caller a callback to fill the space when someone no shows). The other thing is the 8 month thing. MOST new sps do not realize that they are busy because they are new and THIS WILL NOT LAST. The only way to deal with this is to make bank during those first 6 months, work smart, and prepare for the slow down becuase it WILL happen. Many clients are not big repeaters, especially ones found thru review sites who specifically like to see the new girl, then move on to the next new girl.

I like the hair conditioner idea. My concern is that the beard is washed, soap and water rinse, prior to me having my face or any other parts right up against it.

Interesting how the votes (as few as there are) mirror these. :shock: But maybe not. It is always assume that Friday and Saturday nights will be busier for sps in or out of mps or agencies, because it is when the young men are out, trying to pick up women, striking out, and with frolicing on their minds, call up the sps lol. My experience overall, for me, is that Friday and Saturday nights are the quietest, but Saturday during the day IF it is busy will be the busiest day out of the week. Some Saturdays are dead of course, hence the need for a crystal ball. :grin:

I kind of think many sps need a multiple choice poll! If only it were that easy to say "yes, Friday morning is the busiest day". Also, some sps have real schedules, and do not make themselves available 7 days a week or based on bookings, but rather work only Mon-Friday. These things will affect the results.

Some sps I know who do outcalls or hotel incalls have a bag with necessities. These will include extra soaps or liquid soap dispenser, towels, sheets, mouthwash, lotions, candles, etc. One also carries along fountains, and sets up scented candles in the bathroom as well as a scarf or something to drape over the lampshade to create softer lighting and something to play her preferred music selection. (being techno challenged, I no longer know what it is you kids have to record music on anymore lol). Then they will also ask for extra towels from housekeeping, and tip when they are delivered, and after they are used and more delivered. It might depend on how long you plan to stay how much you need to bring. Clearly what you need to bring to wear won't take up as much space as towels and sheets!

For a morning appt, I have a reg who tends to bring me a large latte. That is an awesome gift. Also, recently, stay up stockings. It is quite difficult to keep these around, as they tend to snag and run almost as soon as you put them on, yet going out shopping for more is not always convenient. So receiving a couple of pairs recently was a very thoughtful gesture to me.

I would say not at all. But look at what the rate is you are paying, and where you are going. Someone who is independent already has a rate they like, and keeps it all (outside of expenses). An agency or mp sp does not, and an extra 20 goes a long way on top of whatever they normally keep out of the full donation.

I think someone like Chavez needs to be reminded that the sps see a lot more guys than he could possibly see sps, and that they are speaking from experience. So believe it if an sp tells you that drunk and high guys most of the time are incapable of cumming, and the danger is in are they going to accept that they have chosen (by choosing drugs and alcohol) to make cumming impossible, or are they going to blame the sp. And once they blame the sp for not performing a miracle, are they going to get abusive, physically or verbally, or are they going to get pushy and demand to stay past the paid time until they do? And since almost every single sp has the same story, that is a lot of guys doing the same thing and proving the same experience. And imagine that each and every sp has experienced this at least once, and for some many many times over, then now tell me that you know better than she does, based on your one experience: yourself. Besides, already you tell me that you will blame the sp if you cannot cum, if you had had one too many we'll assume, and most likely be one of those sorts who she will never see again, or will be the one to lead her into no calls after 10pm, and no sharing a bottle of wine. It may come as a surprise to you that the majority of guys do not consider 'party" girls good sps, and would rather she was sober, not drunk or high in order to do this job. An sp who needs a couple of drinks (or more), E, coke, meth, whatever, to get through an appt is not someone who is happy doing this work. Is that really who you want to spend time with? You think she is a good time party girl, when in fact she loathes you, views you as a walking wallet, and is foggily trying to figure out a way to persuade you to give her more of it. My guess is chavez is under 25, possibly 21, and we can see more comments about his maturity in the thread about the 21 year olds from a week or so ago lol.

Generally, screening weeds them out. Never see anyone new after 10pm, never ever after midnight. Always always talk to them on the phone; they cannot disguise drunk or high. Can't imagine trying to figure it out from textings. Also, I find a number of review board members encourage newbies to drink, or familiar clients encourage drinking by bringing wine, etc. I find this is disturbing, because alcohol does not increase performance, it decreases it and in some cases eliminates the possibility of orgasm at all. So a big waster of time and $$. The other disturbing part about bringing wine to a session is that obviously someone is leaving impaired, usually the client. I have a zero tolerance for this, as I am not going to be the one to send someone out into their car with a couple of drinks in them. It is very irresponsible. Plus, I have a total body sensual and erotic approach. There is no way anyone can fully experience all the possible sensations if part of their mind is numb. Even one drink, imo is too much, and the guys who also feel the need to pop some other kind of drug, I just feel sorry for. They have no clue how to read their body, and enjoy the experience, imo. In any case, I have no desire to meet this type.

Independents offer privacy and discretion. You deal directly with her (unless you go thru an agency), and she and you are the ones making the connection and appt. You have less chance of surprises on arrival, in other words, if you see an indy. You and she are the only ones in the location. MPs are public business fronts. You will walk into it from a back way or front street entry, not discrete. There is a chance you will encounter other mp clients, either along the way or in the waiting room. You cannot be shy! There will likely be a receptionist person who you will have to talk with first to set up an appt. The pros are that being a business, if you have problems there is a management to complain to. There may be a choice of different sps available, and you can meet them all first then decide. You have the safety of visiting a business, rather than be directed to a location you do not know, or having someone come to see you at home.