Capital Hunter

I am glad that I could clarify this WrinkledInTime and you are welcome. fortunateone, I am not sure I understand the second part of your post (likely me, too late at night) but regarding the first part of your post, when I communicate with the ladies, 1 - I do tell them about the amount of the donations and that fact that the donation is for their time and companionship ONLY in ALL my PMs/emails. 2 - I also tell them that I am an outcall only person for legal reasons (as some are doing incalls only). 3 -I also tell them that everything will be covered (no bbb whatever) for safety reasons and 4- I tell them also that I love kissing and hugging and this is an expected service and ask them if they would provide that service. 5-There is NOT a single word about FS or sex. 6- I tell them all this when inviting them as guests (I tell them I can have guests only weekends). I play it strickly by the book, so to speak to ensure the of PM/email and subsequent interaction are both completely legal and safe. And btw, the open envelop is right before them on the table next to the chocolate gift where thet can see upon arrival. When they are here as guests after chatting and chocolate and wineing I ask them (in the form of a question) if they would like to accompany me to the bedroom. It is their decision to make.

To be clearer I don't know where did this come from but nobody even hinted that. Treat them like guests all I said not hired employees. Greet them at the door, welcome them. smile at them. walk them to and from elevator, wine or dine them. Chocolate them. flower them, buy them small gifts, hug them and kiss them. Make them feel at home. Make them feel beautiful and happy. Make sure they enjoy their time or do your best to ensure that.. ..... Do I need to go on???.

May be true but can we not make them feel that they are not hired employees but rather precious/valued guests in our house and make them feel that they are a princess and a treasure and that we respect them and value them like a treasure?? And show them a great time to the best that we can??

I don't hire SPs OutForFun!!!!. I invite the ladies to be guests in my house and she is treated like one not like an employee lol. In my PM/email I communicate with them the fact that they are invited as guests (i.e I always say I can have guests on weekends) and if they can make it for certain time and date kissing/hugging/cuddling is not the minimum but is all I expect. The rest (FS) is icing on the cake, so to speak, if the lady decides to grant the service. I ask them if they would like to accompany me to the bedroom and it is their choice if they do. What would you suggest me to say or do instead that I don"t do OutForFun?? Isn't that how you would ask your girlfriend too lol?. If the lady has a no-kissing policy for whatever reason, she can of course decline the invitation in her PM/email lol.

OutForFun, The envelop is for her time and companionship. The rest is decided between consenting adults. More specifically, for escorts (as unlike dancers the emotional component is not there for first timers) I expect kissing/hugging/cuddling. I communicate with them about the fact beforehand. When they show up I expect them to live up to their promise on kissing/hugging. That is the only thing that I ask and expect from them and I let them know beforehand. If they dislike me enough to break the promise then they have the choice to leave but without the envelop (has never happened by the visiting lady but I have refused kissing in a few cases when I did not see fit - signs of drug use or scars, bad smell, improper hygiene but with full pay). I never communicate to them about FS. This is very intimate and is a service that I hope the lady would provide if she likes me enough to get that intimate. I do not automatically expect or assume that service. She can only decide after she sees me and can make up her mind. After initial conversing/chocolate/wineing I ask them if they would like to accompany me to the bedroom and the decision is entirely theirs lol. As most know I do not take other services which I consider as risky (bbbj, greek, cim., cob,, sw, whatever else is there..) even if offerred. This is my choice (so do not be offended lol). I have never been refused the bedroom, but I have refused it on two occasions with visiting dancers when I was asked. BTW, most (almost all) ladies would love kissing/hugging/cuddling. I do what I can to be clean and healthy for them and treat them as well and as respectful as I can, As guests and like a princess that I believe they are. They feel like they just had a fun date (or that is what they tell me) rather than work. In fact one recently told me that she feels like she should be the one to pay me for pleasure and companionship lol.

CM, If the lady does not like the guy for whatever reason or feels unsafe for whatever reason she has the right to walk away without taking the money lol. It is like any other job. A worker has the right to refuse to work if he/she does not like the job or if it is in a hazardous environment why should an SP be any different, however, he/she likely will not be compensated for job not done. Where did I say that the SP can take your money and walk away or not provide the services that she has promised you before coming over, for no reason lol. With regard to only watching TV, yes I have had nude dancers who did just that. Watching TV together for an hour or two while we were dancing together or sometimes she contact danced for me while watching TV. I have had my best time with private dancers because I know them beforehand and there was a strong emotional component (and caring) to our time. To me GFE is not about a list of services but the emotional attachment and the feeling that I am with my own GF. If you read my latest post (or you didn't bother to read it before commenting) you realize that I did acknowledge that there is a component of pay for sex in SPing, but still insisted that there is a good chance that most SPs would also like their time with most of us (if you treat them well and respectful that I am sure you would). OR DO YOU ALSO DISAGREE WITH THIS LOL??.

Just thought to bump it up Anyone seen this blonde doll who advertises on CL yet? If yes please PM me. Thanks.

Funny you should say this Pete as I was thinking about the same thing. Last day, one of our co-worker was leaving to another company and we took her to a good bye-good luck lunch and at the end, yes we (me included) hugged her and kissed her (not dfk but on the face) to say good bye and wish good luck. The second part, I thought I made it clear that I was joking and being humorous. I apologize if you were offended by it Pete. Additional Comments: Yes you are right about the first part. I didn't realize the la la land is the same as a fictitious world I was asking. My apology. No, I did not mean a debate on my personal life. I made a brief reference to say that it is not 100% of SPs who are after money some really like us enough to wish to become our girlfriends. The memories are old and in a case or two also painful and not subject for debate. What offended me a bit was that you seem to be questioning their motives or implying financial reasons for them choosing to be my GF and that was what I objected as judgement without knowing them (or me) or having all the facts.

The thread was not/is not about me whether I live in a la la land or .... Please don't make this personal, with all due respects. It is a friendly debate and exchange of views. Besides in my view it is not right to make a judgement when one does not have all the facts (regarding me and my girlfriends and whatever the circumstances).

My concluding remarks: I have read each and every post carefully (and noted those who agreed with a view by nominating a particular post) and my conclusion is that, there is no right and wrong in this subject. There are always those who can strongly debate for and those who can equally strongly debate against. The purpose for this debate was educational and there was no intention for a winner or loser. As like any other subject of life, there are two ways of looking at everything. One may look at a glass of water and describe it as half full and the next person may see it as half empty. One may love her/his work and earn money at the same time and some may not like their work as much but still show on time everyday because they need the paycheque. There are two extremes to this debate and none is 100% true representative of reality. 1 – Ladies whom we see really love us and have great time with us and make good money at the same time and are really looking forward to us calling them back. They are our dates and therefore it is not considered as pay for sex but rather a Rendezvous and is exactly as dating or having a GF (whom we have sex with on a regular basis, after dinner, gift, etc.) whom we usually buy expensive gifts or take her to dinner dates or dance bar. This was the questionable view that I started the thread and asked for cerbites to comment on pros and cons. 2 – The ladies hate us and hate their time with us. The only reason they do it is because they need money or they are under pressure to earn money by someone or pay for a bad habit. They watch the clock and pray that the time passes fast. They hate themselves later for what they have to do and take a long shower afterwards. They do not wish to think back or be reminded of us after they leave our house. Scenario number 1 is both moral and legal. Scenario number 2 is both immoral and illegal. I would like to think that in my case, it is closer to the first scenario than second and hope that pray that is the case. As a realist (and I have all you to thank for opening my eyes to reality) I would say that the reality is somewhat in between the above two scenarios and in my view a lot closer to scenario number 1, than second. In fact I firmly believe and hope that all of us hobbyists would do everything possible and our absolute best when seeing these ladies by being respectful, treating them like a princess that they are and as guests in our house (or in their house if we take incalls) to make sure that in their case it is closer to scenario 1 by far or as close as is in our power, than scenario number 2. This is my updated views on the subject. Most of ladies we see like/love what they do and there is a good chance that they like/love most of us, however, they also do it for pay. So, yes it is pay for sex. Overwhelming majority will not do it if the offer of donation is withdrawn. I say overwhelming majority (but not all) because I have had several cases that the SP I used to see (3 cases of nude dancers becoming my GF, 2 cases asking to become my GF and one case of escort also indicating her willingness to become my GF). So, above scenario is not applicable to everyone but I would say overwhelming majority. Just like, I love my job too but if they stop paying me then I would start looking for alternative jobs but that does not mean that I hate my job, but I need the cheques to pay for my living expenses. Same applies to most SPs lol. However, I still believe that hugging and kissing and cuddling is not a sexual act (we do it all the time to our close family members and friends of opposite sex lol) and is totally different with dfk which I consider as sexual act lol. My final views for what it worth and they are my personal views which means they are mine and I do not expect everyone to agree with them either. Again thank you very much everyone for your participation in the debate and your comments.

You sure it is not viagra lol:D, just kidding. Thought to add some humor to a very hot thread lol. No seriously PP. cuddling and hugging and kissing is what most people are doing. I mean close family members (parents hug and cuddle and kiss their children), friends of oppsite sex (or same sex lady friends too) . We may be on a different wavelength but they are totally different with dfk lol as stated in a post before. I don't cuddle or hug with my lips or my tongue inside someone else's lol.

What a beauty WOW:D. One of Canada"s many treasures:). Your posts always cheer me up Cato. Thanks. Oh yes happy birthday UT.

Tomorrow is a great day. It is the birth of the best country in the world. Let us all celebrate this great day as loudly and as widely as we possibly can. Happy birthday Canada and Happy Canada Day cerbites. God bless our homeland forever.

I am not trying to convince anyone dear. I opened a thread for debate. I expressed my view as a starter. I was/am open to all comments for and against my own original views. I would love to read them and make my own conclusions based on the posted comments and then form an opinion. We are all friends on this board. We debate and learn from each other. That was the purpose. When I started the thread, I stated my view on the subject at the time, in order to start the thread. It was more like in the form of a question than a firm view (please read my OP where I asked readers if I live in an imaginary fictitious world of my own) and then politely requested others to enter their views (pros and cons alike welcomed) on the subject. My view by no means is/was cast in stone and can be changing as the majority (of lady providers) who posted seem to indicate that hobbying is paying for sex. I am not firm on my opinions (as a few posts has indicated there is no 100% right or wrong in this subject and as you can see my original post has received positively by quite a few as well, including a lady service provider) or never claim I am unconditionally right. I respect other people's views and believe in the freedom of speech. And yes I could be wrong. I am only a human lol. Have to wake up 5:00 am for work lol. Sorry if I offended you dear. Have sweet dreams.

Thank you very much Megan. Very kind of you and highly appreciate your comments.

I never thought of hugging and kissing and cuddling as sexual contact. I haven't been hobbying for long but always thought that the visiting lady can refuse the client or services if she so wishes for whatever reason. I have conversed with lady escorts that they told me that they have refused dfk or daty when the client had a sore on his mouth or even sex when he had bad hygiene. So, all these are coming as shocking news to me lol:shock:!!! I thought it does not matter what a client expect but rather what the lady sees suitable lol. Obviously the purpose for starting this thread was educational and though there has been a few comments more or less in line with my views (and bendex fully agreed with me) however, it appears that our view is likely not in a majority view from SP's point of view so far. I guess I am kind of an optimist as everyone tells me I am in life that I assume that the ladies who see me and appear happy and say they had great time with me and persistently asking me to call them back soon, they all really mean it. It would be kind of heartbreaking if proven otherwise that they all have been for monetary gains only lol:(. I particularly liked flyer's response. I think he got some of his comments right out of my mouth and his post has been nominated by quite a few already. If I knew it is going to be such a hot topic when I started the thread, I would have started it in the form of an anonymous poll to see exactly what percentage of respondents or readers are supportive of my way of viewing the hobby and how many percent otherwise (pay for sex). Regardless, I would like to clarify that I fully respect everyone's views and comments. Again thank you all for your participations.

Thanks everyone for your time, comments and participation so far. I can see that the first two respondents are at least partially agree with me and after reading the comments I do agree to an extend that this question is not a black and white thing as first it appears (to me) to be. Outforfun, of course you are entitled to your view by all means and I sincerely thank you for your participation but I beg to differ for the following reasons: As I mentioned I have had nude dancers, private dancing with no sex that I had as guests and we both had great time with wine and chocolate and music and flashing lights, really partying with lots of hugs and kisses. They have been invited back too. This means I paid for their companionship and NOT sex. The reason I did not recommend them because almost all dancer strongly prefer to remain anonymous however I have recommended many dancers I have seen in the clubs. My point is that if the lady visits you as a guest and is treated as a guest (or you are in her place as a guest) and the choice is all hers as what to provide and not to provide based on many factors, including the hobbyist's looks and hygiene (that is why most of us use the term YMMV when recommending) and she equally enjoys her time and we reward them for their time and companionship, then what is the difference between this and dating which we take our date to a dinner or bars or buy her expensive jewelry or gifts on a regular basis to reward our GF for being there and joy she provides us with her companionship?. I do agree that this may not apply to those ladies who work for agencies as some (likely most) of those ladies are under pressure and would be hard for them to refuse a client or services as they would likely get into trouble with their boss. That is likely why I have strong preference for independents who are on their own, In particular cerb indies lol. To answer SmartnSexy's question, yes I used to spend a larger percentage of my income (as graduate student I was earning some) on girlfriends that I used to have while in Montreal than now I spend on hobbying lol. Thanks eveyone again for your contributions and participations so far and future posts as well. It is becoming an interesting thread thanks to all of you.

I have noticed a recent comment or two referring to hobbying as paying for sex. I beg to differ and this is my personal view. To me hobbying is NOT paying for sex and I do not get upset by it at all and these are my reasons: I invite a lady to my home as a guest(or she invites us to hers for those who do incalls) and I pay for lady's time and companionship only. By all means she is a guest in my house (or we are a guests in hers, if incalls) and is treated like one (and many like myself do their best to ensure they feel like guests). What happens after is between two consenting adults. They do not have to do what they wish not to. And they can leave if they wish too. In many cases when I invite nude dancers there is no FS. In most cases the visiting lady has equally good time (I can tell by her wet ......and hot body and flushed face lol) and thank us for the great time she has had. It is a date (RendezVous) not pay for sex. The only difference is that I use cerb (or internet) to find my date instead of going to a dance bar or night club and I donate for her time and kindness with material value in an envelop rather than dinner or jewelry or ring, etc. The reason for hobbying in my case is the "Variety" factor. I love variety. It is possible to do this in certain cities like Montreal (where I lived for 6 years before moving to Ottawa) by going to a night club or dance bar or at the university social events and every Saturday night (with a good chance) to come out with a different lady. I used to do this myself for 6 years (besides as student I didn"t have money to hobby). This is not possible in a relatively small city like Ottawa. Therefore if I want to do what I enjoy most (playing the "variety" game), then I have to hobby (or go back to Montreal where likely I won't have a job). I consider visiting ladies as guests and I hope that they are equally feel like being a guest and having a real good time. How many of you would agree that we should enjoy our time and be happy and how many would disagree that in fact hobbying is indeed paying for sex or we should be upset about it? Am I too optimistic living in a fictitious imaginary world of my own, or at least some of you would share my view?. Views from lady providers are specially welcomed. I do hope that this post does not offend anyone, otherwise I would have to request the mod for its removal. PS - This post is not in any way with reference to any individual or individuals and only expresses my personal views on hobbying.

You may wish to try LadyClass. She is tall, slender, sexy and hot in the CR. She dances daytime at Taboo.

You are welcome SNS724. Glad to read that she is going into many lists. Hi Kayla: Most welcome sweetie. You deserved it princess:). I nickname you as "blondie princess".

Thank you very much Cato and Mark for your kind comments. I work hard and long hours weekdays and am real stressed by weekend and have to take a break for a day no matter what the cost (whether I have disposable income or not) or I would go crazy and end up in mental hospital Mark:). Fortunately I have been lucky so far as overwhelming majority of ladies that I have seen so far have been hits rather than misses. I count my blessing for this luck LOL (considering the fact that most of the ladies I see are from CL and even some oriental (because naturally unshaven:)), I have been extremely lucky)..

Thank you very much Jabba. Yes she is a sweetie (yummy), cutie, blondie teenager of German background. Just turn 19, two weeks ago.

I was intrigued when I saw Kayla's pictures advertised on CL a few days ago but was not sure about the accuracy of pictures and her description as 19 year old blue eyed natural blonde but yesterday when I noticed her joining cerb as a new SP I become confident that with these descriptions she must be a hit and boy I was right. We exchanged a few PMs and set the date for this afternoon. She arrived on time. A relatively tall young very slim cute blonde teenager and smiling. We conversed for some minutes and then the real fun started. Kayla is every teenager's dream girl. She is a tall slim natural blue eyed friendly blonde with soft relatively pale skin who enjoys conversing and giving pleasure. This future car mechanics has just graduated from school and is now working part time as escort. She has beautiful soft natural blonde hair and changing blue eyes who loves kissing and hugging. She has beautiful large natural boobs and sexy bum too. Her kitty is very pink, soft, moist and tasty. Her face is so cute that I kept on kissing her cheeks and chin most of the time. I also kept on kissing her beautiful very soft blonde hair and even her blue eyes too. She made me feel that I was very desired and make passionate sounds and showed that she is really having a good time (either that or she will have a great career as an actress). She is highly recommended for those who like young natural blue eyed blonde and true spinners with teenage looks. She provides both physical and emotional aspects of GFE. I was planning to also call for beautiful brunette Sacha on CL (a blonde-brunette combo would have been great. Also to maximize the restricted private time I have nowadays as I have to pay huge to take my summer time visitor to a hotel for just a few hours) but Kayla left me so fulfilled, I decided to postpone that call until next week at least. She is relatively new to the biz and a very sweet beautiful young lady. If you have her please treat her softly and with ulmost respect that a young lady deserves. She is here on cerb as Kayla19. I would like to extend my thanks to Kayla for the great time. Kayla's Secret Admirer Edit: I received a PM from a very trusty friend on cerb (whom I fully trust is fully respectful to ladies he sees) this morning that likely indicates that Kayla may be a strong case of YMMV (I did mention YMMV as I do for all my recos). Though I had really good time with her (and my post is based on my own experience with her), but I never ask for bbbj or hj so I wouldn't have known about the quality or dollar quantity of those services with her or any SP. I felt only fair (though very painful as I loved her and my time with her) that I had to add this edit part. The friend acknowledged the fact that she is very pretty on plus side. Latest: On another (plus) note, Kayla has offered a free hour to make up for the past (not great) date with the cerb friend. It is understandable to large extend. We (hobbyists, SPs alike) are all humans not robots. We have changing moods and feelings and as we all have good and bad days at work and so do the SPs but only the ones with full integrity (I am sure most if not all cerb SPs) and sense of responsibility and fairness like Kayla would offer to make it up to their clients with a free date when for any reason they can't perform to their best during a date.

Most welcome kih. It is always great to see posts from you, though wished it could have been more like the old times. Always a gentleman with full integrity. I have a tentative date with Makayla tomorrow, but if anyone sees Amy please review her and let her know about cerb (likely Amy is incall only:sad:). As the OP said, she looks real hot.