I'm an Idiot :P

[Taffer 2280]

Classic cash and dash, obvious excuse about leaving something in the car...I'm an idiot.

Not like there is much I can do, even hesitant to name any names as she knows where I live now. I guess it might be as good a time as any to move though.

I've had this happen before and I just kept it to myself out of fear, that's what these people are counting on.

Really tired of having no rights as a client, thinking I'm done with all but well reviewed providers.

[fr33yay0 1172]

Sorry this has happened to you. I have been lucky so far as a client but I only do research and speak to the provider first. Those classic "forgot" somethings are boring...

[Taffer 2280]

Sorry this has happened to you. I have been lucky so far as a client but I only do research and speak to the provider first. Those classic "forgot" somethings are boring...

 

Yeah, got caught up in "taking one for the team", screw the team, let's see how quickly laws change when men only visit with established providers and other providers can't enter the business any more. Give me some basic rights and maybe I'll take risks in the future. Doesn't matter what precautions you take with an unknown provider you can always get screwed (or not in this case :D)

[drlove 37204]

Unfortunately, that's part of the risk that comes with toftt. Very unfortunate this happened to you, but at least if you stick with established, well reviewed ladies, when she says she forgot something and she'll be right back, you'll know she's telling the truth.

[MichMelle 1050]

Wow! Sorry to hear that..It's a good idea to spread the word around so it becomes more of a social issue, as it is not easy on us new women entering the industry and trying to build an honest reputation for ourselves when there is this kind of stuff going on...

 

Hope next time you really take the proper precautions and do your research !

 

Take care love,

Michelle Monet

[blacklabdog 3049]

wow - sorry this happened to you

[Guest Prufrock Cummings]

I am sorry to hear this happened to you Taffer. I do not think you are an idiot as you have named this thread; you are just human. I would have thought nothing if someone told me they forgot something in the car (especially if she said condoms).

[Parker 19761]

Really tired of having no rights as a client.

 

I understand that people say this out of anger and frustration,

But, (and it's a big one, lol..) There are plenty of working ladies all over this country who go above and beyond for clients.

 

A lady doesn't have to be "well-reviewed" to have put some effort into her website, Twitter, ads, etc.. She just has to care about her clients and her business. A lot of us are proud of the reputation we've built/are building for our working names & businesses. The best way to encourage such attitudes is to give your business to those putting in the effort.

(You might also want to review these ladies on another site where you can post negative information. I personally feel that if there's someone out there actually robbing clients, people should know who so they can avoid them.)

 

Guys, you do have to be careful.. you are legally disadvantaged.

And taking risks are definitely not needed to keep the industry going, if anything they hurt more than they help as they are likely to end badly and totally turn good potential clients off of Service Providers altogether.

You are free to take any risks you like obviously, but they're totally not needed- Promise! ;)

 

With a little research and thought put in, seeing a SP can be a really rewarding experience.. It's sad that it has to be put that way, but at the moment it's our reality.

 

And Taffer.. You are not an idiot.

You were trying to be a decent person and some seriously shitty person took advantage of that.. I'm really sorry that happened to you.

 

That sort of behaviour is not only unprofessional and disgusting, it's also an insult to professional ladies everywhere. I hope these incidents didn't sully your perception of us as I'm sure there are ladies out there who would noticeably value and appreciate your patronage.

 

xx

[Taffer 2280]

Wow! Sorry to hear that..It's a good idea to spread the word around so it becomes more of a social issue, as it is not easy on us new women entering the industry and trying to build an honest reputation for ourselves when there is this kind of stuff going on...

 

Hope next time you really take the proper precautions and do your research !

 

Take care love,

Michelle Monet

 

I apologize in advance if what I'm about to say sounds a little cold, but your statements are in conflict with each other.

On the one hand I sympathize that it is difficult for you to enter the business when potential clients are unwilling to take the risk with you, but you have to understand that "taking the proper precautions and doing my research" would lead me to never visit a provider that hasn't established a good reputation.

 

There were no warnings written about this girl, no one had anything bad to say. The only precaution I could have taken is not seeing her at all.

Of course I could have done things differently during the interaction. I could have demanded that she leave the money before retrieving something from her car, but there is no guarantee she would have done so, and the law is inherently on her side.

 

I handled the situation the best way I could to avoid getting myself into real trouble beyond financial loss. I have no rights under the law to report that she stole from me. You have to understand that clients have no rights, and as a result many of us will be very reluctant to visit new providers. If you are a new provider and are having trouble finding clients, then join the fight for client rights.

 

We are reluctant to get involved in the fight for our own rights due to the public shaming that will result. Many clients have their reputations on the line and would be risking far to much getting involved in the fight for decriminalization on both sides.

 

Additional Comments:

I understand that people say this out of anger and frustration,

But, (and it's a big one, lol..) There are plenty of working ladies all over this country who go above and beyond for clients.

 

A lady doesn't have to be "well-reviewed" to have put some effort into her website, Twitter, ads, etc.. She just has to care about her clients and her business. A lot of us are proud of the reputation we've built/are building for our working names & businesses. The best way to encourage such attitudes is to give your business to those putting in the effort.

(You might also want to review these ladies on another site where you can post negative information. I personally feel that if there's someone out there actually robbing clients, people should know who so they can avoid them.)

 

Guys, you do have to be careful.. you are legally disadvantaged.

And taking risks are definitely not needed to keep the industry going, if anything they hurt more than they help as they are likely to end badly and totally turn good potential clients off of Service Providers altogether.

You are free to take any risks you like obviously, but they're totally not needed- Promise! ;)

 

With a little research and thought put in, seeing a SP can be a really rewarding experience.. It's sad that it has to be put that way, but at the moment it's our reality.

 

And Taffer.. You are not an idiot.

You were trying to be a decent person and some seriously shitty person took advantage of that.. I'm really sorry that happened to you.

 

That sort of behaviour is not only unprofessional and disgusting, it's also an insult to professional ladies everywhere. I hope these incidents didn't sully your perception of us as I'm sure there are ladies out there who would noticeably value and appreciate your patronage.

 

xx

 

I don't fully understand your point of view, how would the industry continue if none of us ever took a risk on the new girl? Sp's retire, change occupations, etc. Like any market segment, the new eventually has to replace the old, otherwise the demand will significantly outnumber the supply. If you have a solution to this long term problem, I'm all ears.

[Parker 19761]

I don't fully understand your point of view, how would the industry continue if none of us ever took a risk on the new girl? Sp's retire, change occupations, etc. Like any market segment, the new eventually has to replace the old, otherwise the demand will significantly outnumber the supply. If you have a solution to this long term problem, I'm all ears.

 

Nothing about being new means they can't make a website, an account here and post on various subjects, Twitter, blogs, knowing other providers..

 

Maybe someone can explain to me how seeing totally unknown new providers, who make no attempt whatsoever to look like a "real" provider trying to build up her name, is helpful to the industry?

Yes, the new have to replace the old in any industry- but seeing fakes and getting scammed isn't supporting the new anyways, it's supporting the fakes and frauds, & I can't see how that could be helpful to any industry.

 

I was a new provider once (as were and are many ladies here,) and the only thing that was really different were the amount of posts and reviews I have.. I emulated the successful women by making a website and having photos, etc. With a little research it was almost as easy to see I was genuine and cared about my business as it is now.

 

Taking risks, (depending on the amount taken, luck and the outcomes of such) can work out fine, but it also has a high chance it won't and the clients doing so can start becoming bitter, jaded or even paranoid to the point that they interfere with our ability to screen for safety.. not to mention it can give them a negative view of the industry and other, more reputable providers.

While this is obviously only my opinion and I could be totally wrong; men could be relentlessly undentable and able to be ripped off repeatedly without it ever changing their perception of the industry-- the things guys post when (and sometimes continue to post even long after,) they've been ripped off, swindled and cheated out of hard earned money, leads me to believe that this is not the case.

 

I very much do want those who have never seen a provider before, are overly nervous or are worried about scary situations/being ripped off to know that this sort of situation doesn't have to happen and for some it never does.

You can have an amazing time, a rewarding experience and just enjoy yourself without taking unnecessary risks.

There are lots of amazing and genuine ladies out there and they're easier to find than it sometimes sounds! ;)

[WhereIRoam 21825]

Sorry this happened, it does to most of us at one point or another. Not that it makes what occurred to you any better.

 

I prefer the thrill of the hunt aspect, 95% of my visits are TOFTT.

When I first started in the hobby yes, this bad experience did happen once, but I learned. I've TOFTTd, I'd guess about 75 times so the odds...(what ever the math is).

 

Point is, if you enjoy it like I do, don't let one bad one stop you. I'm sure a punter who has seen an established provider has not enjoyed his encounter but he too keeps doing what he enjoys best.

 

Better luck next time. Hope you find I hidden gem next time!

[Mikeyboy 27134]

I don't think it makes you an idiot because you "fell for it". The truth is that even if you were suspicious of her motives at that point, there really wasn't much you could have done about it, short of threatening her or attempting to physically restrain her. Not a road you want to go down. We are always at risk of this particular scam as it is always cash upfront. If she decides to leave, there's not much you can do about it.

 

The trick is finding a lady who's name and reputaion are likely worth more to her than the one envelope.

 

Best of luck next time Taffer.

[Taffer 2280]

Nothing about being new means they can't make a website, an account here and post on various subjects, Twitter, blogs, knowing other providers..

 

Maybe someone can explain to me how seeing totally unknown new providers, who make no attempt whatsoever to look like a "real" provider trying to build up her name, is helpful to the industry?

Yes, the new have to replace the old in any industry- but seeing fakes and getting scammed isn't supporting the new anyways, it's supporting the fakes and frauds, & I can't see how that could be helpful to any industry.

 

I was a new provider once (as were and are many ladies here,) and the only thing that was really different were the amount of posts and reviews I have.. I emulated the successful women by making a website and having photos, etc. With a little research it was almost as easy to see I was genuine and cared about my business as it is now.

 

Taking risks, (depending on the amount taken, luck and the outcomes of such) can work out fine, but it also has a high chance it won't and the clients doing so can start becoming bitter, jaded or even paranoid to the point that they interfere with our ability to screen for safety.. not to mention it can give them a negative view of the industry and other, more reputable providers.

While this is obviously only my opinion and I could be totally wrong; men could be relentlessly undentable and able to be ripped off repeatedly without it ever changing their perception of the industry-- the things guys post when (and sometimes continue to post even long after,) they've been ripped off, swindled and cheated out of hard earned money, leads me to believe that this is not the case.

 

I very much do want those who have never seen a provider before, are overly nervous or are worried about scary situations/being ripped off to know that this sort of situation doesn't have to happen and for some it never does.

You can have an amazing time, a rewarding experience and just enjoy yourself without taking unnecessary risks.

There are lots of amazing and genuine ladies out there and they're easier to find than it sometimes sounds! ;)

 

Alright fair enough, I see what you're saying. Certainly someone who takes the time to set up a website, take professional photos, post publicly, etc is far less likely to be swindling people.

 

That still takes us back to the problem of supply and demand though. There are few providers that want to put in the effort to start a website or to join Lyla in my part of the country. Legitimate backpage girls outnumber sp's with websites and lyla accounts 10/1. So it's somewhat problematic to suggest that all clients stay away from backpage.

 

I see 2 solutions to this problem, one is decriminalization for clients, the other is removing backpage from the equation, forcing potential providers to put in the effort to build an independent website. I don't know that either are likely to happen.

[Parker 19761]

Alright fair enough, I see what you're saying. Certainly someone who takes the time to set up a website, take professional photos, post publicly, etc is far less likely to be swindling people.

 

That still takes us back to the problem of supply and demand though. There are few providers that want to put in the effort to start a website or to join Lyla in my part of the country. Legitimate backpage girls outnumber sp's with websites and lyla accounts 10/1. So it's somewhat problematic to suggest that all clients stay away from backpage.

 

I see 2 solutions to this problem, one is decriminalization for clients, the other is removing backpage from the equation, forcing potential providers to put in the effort to build an independent website. I don't know that either are likely to happen.

 

There are more easy to find, cheap deals, girls who have no idea what they're doing, and most definitely, fake and scams on backpage.. but there most certainly are NOT more real ladies.. I mean, there is if you want to do absolutely no research- but we can't help how little work men want to put in.

 

(There are 265 ads in the Ottawa classifieds sections here.. if you think there are thousands of real escorts in Ottawa- I'd take another look at the actual demand. It's only high enough to hold so many girls.. that's why that 265 doesn't change much. You look at TERB ads in TO and you'll see the difference population and demand make.)

 

If you guys want to put in absolutely no effort, then yes.. there's more on backpage, but it's also where all the people wanting to scam you guys go. (Especially since the attitude on BP is escorts are dirty and worthless.)

So if she's on BP and nowhere else, I'm not entirely sure what else you guys expect. If they're hiding from the rest of the industry on BP, the attitude typically is to see and make as much money from as many suckers as possible and then change names and numbers or move on- not exactly the type of attitude that makes for positive experiences.

[WhereIRoam 21825]

(Especially since the attitude on BP is escorts are dirty and worthless.)

So if she's on BP and nowhere else, I'm not entirely sure what else you guys expect. If they're hiding from the rest of the industry on BP, the attitude typically is to see and make as much money from as many suckers as possible and then change names and numbers or move on- not exactly the type of attitude that makes for positive experiences.

 

With all due respect, I do not agree that "the attitude on BP is escorts are dirty and worthless". As a punter and long time BP viewer as well as one who enjoys variety while having done many TOFTTs my experience has not been that "typical for SPs who advertise on BP and cannot be found anywhere else" is not that "they try to make as money as they can from suckers". I, for one, have had more pleasant and enjoyable experiences from visiting BP only advertisers than bad ones. I cannot deny that some do the negative things you mention but I cannot say, from my many years of experience with the BP route, that it is "typical".

[Parker 19761]

With all due respect, I do not agree that "the attitude on BP is escorts are dirty and worthless". As a punter and long time BP viewer as well as one who enjoys variety while having done many TOFTTs my experience has not been that "typical for SPs who advertise on BP and cannot be found anywhere else" is not that "they try to make as money as they can from suckers". I, for one, have had more pleasant and enjoyable experiences from visiting BP only advertisers than bad ones. I cannot deny that some do the negative things you mention but I cannot say, from my many years of experience with the BP route, that it is "typical".

 

You're also totally and completely on the wrong side to be hearing the opinions of the majority of people who contact us after we post to BP, unless you have a secret side job I'm unaware of? lol.

Sadly, it's not very good and there's a lot of it coming from a lot of different numbers. (I might get 100 replies to my one post there, just in the morning too, but if 9 out of 10 ask for BB, to trade me drugs or call me names, speak disgustingly to me, etc- it can get very tiresome VERY fast.. Especially when you're paying $5 a bump to be treated and spoken to like that. It really chases away more of the decent providers than not.)

 

As a client, you may think that the majority of other men seeking ladies there are like you, normal and mentally sound, respectful of women- though I can for sure say, the majority there are not like that at all.

 

In my years in the industry I've had my faults, but having a thin skin is definitely not one of them and even I have had to turn off my phone and walk away to keep from being totally demoralized by the replies from there and I've never gotten that from anywhere else or even anywhere on the internet, industry related or not.

 

.. I've thought about posting about just some of the replies that I get after bumping on BP, but I think the majority of decent men would be horrified and I'm not one to go out of my way to turn people off of the industry.

[Taffer 2280]

There are more easy to find, cheap deals, girls who have no idea what they're doing, and most definitely, fake and scams on backpage.. but there most certainly are NOT more real ladies.. I mean, there is if you want to do absolutely no research- but we can't help how little work men want to put in.

 

(There are 265 ads in the Ottawa classifieds sections here.. if you think there are thousands of real escorts in Ottawa- I'd take another look at the actual demand. It's only high enough to hold so many girls.. that's why that 265 doesn't change much. You look at TERB ads in TO and you'll see the difference population and demand make.)

 

If you guys want to put in absolutely no effort, then yes.. there's more on backpage, but it's also where all the people wanting to scam you guys go. (Especially since the attitude on BP is escorts are dirty and worthless.)

So if she's on BP and nowhere else, I'm not entirely sure what else you guys expect. If they're hiding from the rest of the industry on BP, the attitude typically is to see and make as much money from as many suckers as possible and then change names and numbers or move on- not exactly the type of attitude that makes for positive experiences.

 

Alright, maybe 10/1 for real ladies on bp was a "slight" exxageration, in my area it's probably more like 3-5/1. I live in NS, at any given time there are ~5-10 sps advertising on Lyla. There are also ~5 sps in the area with permanent websites. Then there are 20-30 ads on bp and in my experience at least 75% are legit. Most of the 25% that aren't can often be ruled out with some research and caution.

 

If I lived in Toronto, I wouldn't feel the need to ever visit backpage. Perhaps I was wrong to suggest its a matter of supply and demand, it's more a matter of the variety of the supply. Most of us men enjoy the added bonus of variety in this hobby, it's just the way we are wired. If I wanted a long term girlfriend, there are much more affordable alternatives.

 

Additional Comments:

You're also totally and completely on the wrong side to be hearing the opinions of the majority of people who contact us after we post to BP, unless you have a secret side job I'm unaware of? lol.

Sadly, it's not very good and there's a lot of it coming from a lot of different numbers. (I might get 100 replies to my one post there, just in the morning too, but if 9 out of 10 ask for BB, to trade me drugs or call me names, speak disgustingly to me, etc- it can get very tiresome VERY fast.. Especially when you're paying $5 a bump to be treated and spoken to like that. It really chases away more of the decent providers than not.)

 

As a client, you may think that the majority of other men seeking ladies there are like you, normal and mentally sound, respectful of women- though I can for sure say, the majority there are not like that at all.

 

In my years in the industry I've had my faults, but having a thin skin is definitely not one of them and even I have had to turn off my phone and walk away to keep from being totally demoralized by the replies from there and I've never gotten that from anywhere else or even anywhere on the internet, industry related or not.

 

.. I've thought about posting about just some of the replies that I get after bumping on BP, but I think the majority of decent men would be horrified and I'm not one to go out of my way to turn people off of the industry.

 

I don't doubt you for a minute on this. Most of us have been on the internet long enough to know that there are a lot of disrespectful people lurking out there. Your right that we are not on the receiving end in this case, but it's not as though I haven't witnessed how sketchy online communities treat women.

 

Men generally have to deal with threats of violence online, women have to deal with that and a heaping of sexual harassment online. I sympathize, and I understand your disinclination toward back page.

[Parker 19761]

Alright, maybe 10/1 for real ladies on bp was a "slight" exxageration, in my area it's probably more like 3-5/1. I live in NS, at any given time there are ~5-10 sps advertising on Lyla. There are also ~5 sps in the area with permanent websites. Then there are 20-30 ads on bp and in my experience at least 75% are legit. Most of the 25% that aren't can often be ruled out with some research and caution.

 

If I lived in Toronto, I wouldn't feel the need to ever visit backpage. Perhaps I was wrong to suggest its a matter of supply and demand, it's more a matter of the variety of the supply. Most of us men enjoy the added bonus of variety in this hobby, it's just the way we are wired. If I wanted a long term girlfriend, there are much more affordable alternatives.

 

While there are significantly less in the Halifax classifieds here, there use to be a couple boards that were mainly for the East coast.. Have you tried checking them?

I know that a lot more Toronto girls advertise on the Toronto board (where the majority of board members are in their area,) so maybe the same is true for those in the East?

[WhereIRoam 21825]

There are more easy to find, cheap deals, girls who have no idea what they're doing, and most definitely, fake and scams on backpage...If you guys want to put in absolutely no effort, then yes.. there's more on backpage, but it's also where all the people wanting to scam you guys go. (Especially since the attitude on BP is escorts are dirty and worthless.)

...If they're hiding from the rest of the industry on BP, the attitude typically is to see and make as much money from as many suckers as possible and then change names and numbers

 

With all due respect, I do not agree that "the attitude on BP is escorts are dirty and worthless". As a punter and long time BP viewer as well as one who enjoys variety while having done many TOFTTs my experience has not been that "typical for SPs who advertise on BP and cannot be found anywhere else" is not that "they try to make as money as they can from suckers". I, for one, have had more pleasant and enjoyable experiences from visiting BP only advertisers than bad ones. I cannot deny that some do the negative things you mention but I cannot say, from my many years of experience with the BP route, that it is "typical".

 

You're also totally and completely on the wrong side...

 

As a punter I'm pretty sure this would put me on right side. I'm pretty I have encountered more SPs on BP. ***shrugs shoulders***

[Guest]

The problem with BP is even if I rather not advertise there as there are many sites that are better if only in looks guys first think of BP to look for someone,it is the Hygrade dilemma .

So there is no way out,even Lyla that I love is for me more for entertainment as it is very rare I get real life contact from here.

 

So what I hope in posting on BP is that to know I am legit the gentleman will go one step further and yes look first on my BP ads but cross reference on other sites either my ads or my board presence.

 

About the wallet in the car thing? It happened to me once as I was hosting and I was sure that he'll never come back but he did! I was really surprised and happy.

 

I was less happy when a ,now ex,regular tried to pull that one so I would give him the session free,sigh.

 

And I agree with the one who said the OP is not an idiot,it happens to everyone to make mistake. Mine would keep you entertained for a while,I guess I am a slow learner ,I even repeated some...

[Taffer 2280]

As a punter I'm pretty sure this would put me on right side. I'm pretty I have encountered more SPs on BP. ***shrugs shoulders***

 

I think you're misinterpreting her response. She appears to be stating that we are on the wrong side of things to fully understand how poorly service providers posting on backpage are treated, by many who respond to the ads. Just because we are gentlemen doesn't mean there aren't a lot of scumbags, and they appear to gravitate toward backpage ads.

 

I agree that we may have a better perspective on the quality of providers posting on backpage, as well as the number of fakes. Hard to say though as escorts appear to have an inconspicuous network of communication, that we as clients are not privy to.

 

All I can say is 80% of my backpage encounters have been positive, and only 5% have been somewhat dangerous. I won't pretend that they are all high class/experienced providers, but sometimes I'm just looking for the girl next door type anyways.

[WhereIRoam 21825]

Well then I would agree how BP SPs get treated compared to those who don't ad there. Most gentlemen are on a board and don't look to make it difficult on SPs. That and the fact that a lot of gentlemen who are a member of a review board tend to not always look on BP.

[Parker 19761]

As a punter I'm pretty sure this would put me on right side. I'm pretty I have encountered more SPs on BP. ***shrugs shoulders***

 

As a punter, you're on the right side to know how other punters behave when contacting us for bookings?

 

... I'm totally lost as how this is possible without being one of us, please explain.

 

Edit: Some how I missed your reply directly under this one, sorry..

But what Taffer said is dead on, there are some perfectly lovely Gents who do use BP for whatever reasons.. but it does seem to attract more of the not so desirable ones than sites like Lyla (where others can possibly see their inappropriate behaviour.)

 

The sad part is that places where we use to advertise, that were way classier than BP, are pretty much dead since C36. So you're left without a lot of options and if you're not a high volume provider, it could mean you either post to BP or you leave the industry when you don't get enough work for it to pay for itself. (This is just my experience in Ottawa, but I've heard from other girls that it's not much better elsewhere at the moment.)

[Daisy Mae 2693]

I'm fairly certain you can post on Lyla if a girl robbed you. Lyla just stops the spread of rumours from angry clients who didn't get the BBBJ they tried to force- which IMO makes it a great site, as it doesn't allow clients to try to exploit us via fake reviews.

 

So ya- I think there's a section for posting names of legitimately dangerous girls. I can find it in a moment, hard to bounce between tabs on mobile.

 

Also- sorry this happened to you. You're not an idiot. Anyone can get scammed :(

[WhereIRoam 21825]

@Parker.

Your post on the descripton of SPs on BP...

I interpreted as to how you felt about the SPs on BP.

Taffer clarified that it is a description as to how "you feel" when you ad on BP.

Classic misinterpretation and I later agreed that you could feel like that and listed so just above your last post.