Money

[RobX 2084]

My questions are addressed to the ladies. The questions peripherally concern the degree of sensitivity around the issue of money in the arena of sex work. However, more practically, the questions relate to a particular experience of mine.

 

To set the tone, I would like to ask the ladies:

How would you feel if a client forgot to pay you? I would ask you to hold on to the feelings that this provokes in you when you answer my questions.

 

Now, on to my particular experience. Recently I had a session with my favorite MA. She is an independent whose fee is an all-inclusive fee, with no other options available. I have seen her four times so far and, I totally adore her. My last lession with her was wonderful, as usual, and as I was about to leave, she asked me if I had left the money in the room. At that moment, I realized that I had forgotten to give her money. At that moment in time, I felt that I had committed the ultimate transgression. I really felt like shxx. The way she whispered the word "money", like it was something both sacred and dirty at the same time, made me feel so guilty for what I had just done. In all the time we had spent together, the word "money" had never been spoken, until now. It made be think of something I read on an SPs website, and which stuck in my mind : "Please don't make me ask for the money!"

 

When I got home I emailed her a long apology. She wrote back that it was all OK and that she knew that I didn't do it on purpose. I believe that she is sincere, but I can't help but think that I have damaged our relationship forever - that subconsciously she nows associates me with those clients who may have wronged her in the past.

 

Therefore, my questions to the ladies are:

 

How would you feel if one of your regulars forgot to pay, and you had to ask him for the money?

Would it change you opinion of him?

Would it make you trust him less?

Would you remember every time you saw him?

[SamanthaEvans 166766]

I insist on being paid at the beginning of the meeting. While I prefer not to have to ask for my fee, I will do so if necessary. No one forgets this way. I've only once had a new client claim to have forgotten the money when I said that I thought we should take care of business matters before we went further. He offered to pay me later. I declined the offer. He left and never contacted me again. No harsh words were exchanged.

 

In the situation you've described, since the MA doesn't seem to have such a clear policy, I can see how it might be easy to forget to pay her or even for her to forget to ask for the payment. What's important, though, is that you did pay her when asked and that you also apologized for putting her in the place of having to ask for the fee.

 

It sounds like you have a good rapport with her. If you want to see her again, I'd say go for it and forget about what happened--just remember to pay her when you arrive!

[namssa 562]

I guess I need to ask if you ever did pay her the money that you had forgotten? If so, how did she handle it when you did pay her, any issues? What is the relationship like now?

 

 

 

Especially if she is someone that you have seen regularly and you enjoy a good rapport with and you resolved the financial issue post haste, I can see where it would not impact the relationship. We all make mistakes from time to time, but this is a mistake you must never make again.

 

I have a couple regulars that I have seen each maybe 15 times. I can imagine that if I forgot my donation, and I never would, that it would not be a game changer. I would, of course go directly to an ATM, secure the funding and make good as fast as possible, within the SP's boundaries and my most humble apologies.

 

Last year I was at an Asian Micro, had a great session, got dressed and was about to leave when I remembered that I forgot to give the donation. The girl was surprised, she totally forgot about it until I gave her the money. Had I forgot, I would have called the mamasan and arranged payment with her.

[Megan'sTouch 23875]

I also like to take care of business at the beginning. I feel a little akward having to ask the gentleman because I don't like to embarrass people. The situation you describes certainly wouldn't bother me, assuming you did hand me my fee when I asked for it. If you didnt have my fee for whatever reason, that would create feelings of distrust. It's understandable your mind was elsewhere and I think that means your MA did good job! Next time you see her, hand her fee to her at the very beginning. This way you won't forget and she will feel 100% secure.

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[Emma Alexandra 123367]

I never call it money {present}. I've had it happen a few times. Sometimes we just are so caught up in things that we forget. Forget to mention our "present", forget to leave the "present". Every time it's happened i just ask...did you remember the present? The guys have it and give it to me..no hard feelings. We usually laugh as i know it wasn't done on purpose. I do feel awkward having to ask but hey you would ask if you didn't get paid,right? I've even had times when we both forgot and the gentleman returned right away with it. So i wouldn't worry about it. I'm sure she knows it was an accident. It would be a different story however if you didn't even have the "present" on you. Then I would kick your ass...hahaha

kisses,

Emma

[roamingguy 300292]

I like handling the donation end up front...with it tucked in a gift bag with a gift (after all, I like the gfe, and don't you provide your girlfriend with a gift)

I have money matters set up ahead of the encounter, tucked in an envelope. It is as much a part of preparing for an encounter (in great cases a date) as showering, shaving, etc etc etc

My thoughts

RG

[MightyPen 67414]

When I got home I emailed her a long apology. She wrote back that it was all OK and that she knew that I didn't do it on purpose. I believe that she is sincere, but I can't help but think that I have damaged our relationship forever ...

Don't worry about it. Other than the initial goof of forgetting to leave your fee ("oops!"), you handled everything perfectly -- paid when asked and apologized. You even sent an extra apology later. It's all good, problem solved, just like any little hiccup that can happen between two people.

 

From your initial description you clearly have a good rapport with her and the whole thing is behind you now. Best thing you can do is make another appointment and handle the money thing properly. (If you want to look thoughtful and if it will make you feel better, throw in an extra little tip for this visit by way of material apology.) Then proceed to have a good time together without looking back.

 

Now the whole episode is REALLY behind you, you've resumed normalcy, and you've demonstrated not just that yes, you can be trusted to follow the rules, but also that you have the strength of character to recognize and overcome your mistake.

 

From that point you can continue on together as always, and if anything you'll look better for having properly handled and gotten past this little episode.

[Guest tr*****e]

I hate money, to me it's the ultimate form of slavery. We all want it, need it, etc, yet it leaves so easily. It never cares about my feelings or thoughts, and at this time of year (taxes), it reduces my life to a mere dollar value that I'm worth to politicians, ad nauseum. It makes young guys like me work, sad, dreary jobs so we can eat, exist, and have semblances of lives. That being said, more is always nice.:) So, to the point of this thread, if I forget to pay or don't mention it, it's because I don't like thinking about it. The lady that attracts my attention enough for me to book an appointment with her is already worth more than money to me, so that's never an issue, but remembering my my arch-enemy (money) is.

[fortunateone 156618]

I also don't call it money, but just taking care of business. I cannot think of any good reason to delay payment until the end of the session, you know what you are there for, she knows what you are there for, you've agreed on an amount, just pay it and it's done, and carry on.

 

I can't think of anything that highlights more that this is a paid date encounter than after the fact having the guy leave the $$ on the dresser, or in hand lol. Also, to the guys who realize after the fact they arrived without the $$, are you kidding me? And to go thru the entire appt without having checked that you are prepared to pay? Really?

 

Those are the kind of guys that sour sps to this biz, because they get lumped in with the guys who do actually try to take advantage, and do not return with the $$. To me, if you show up and having checked your pocket, the only way to address that is to prepay, and then there are no awkward moments, she doesn't have to worry about getting ripped off after the event, and you don't have to prove you're a good guy by being one of the guys who has full payment on him paid up after the session.

 

In conclusion, the sp who typically accepts payment after the fact is a fool.

[PistolPete 61421]

Sorry but I disagree with this statement. I have had a "relationship" or seeing a particular SP for over a year or so.

In fact there was many times when I arrive, it was shoes off,coat off and taking me by the hand and straight to the play room.

 

She is not a fool, she trusts me a thousand percent. Of course I always had paid prior to leaving her, she is not a fool, just a very close and dear friend that takes that illusion that it is more then just date, but a passion love affair.

 

Business is/was always dealt with, at professional level by both of us.

 

That said, I repeated with her and other ladies where the envelope is left on a dresser 99.9% of the time, or in her hand prior to session or given after the session.

 

I'm not there with any lady to get a free one, why would I jeopardize my reputation?

 

Fools no, trusting good friends..yes, but you must have a rapport with a lady to gain that trust always.

 

Call it business, call it payment,money,gift,transaction or "donation"

 

 

 

 

In conclusion, the sp who typically accepts payment after the fact is a fool.

[Meg O'Ryan 266444]

I agree Pete! Upstanding gentlemen will always honour their agreement. Quite often I receive my donation at the end of the date and have yet to be disapointed. That being said, with a newbie, I would never go ahead unless all was upfront. A few times I have had to request my donation because we both may have overlooked it in the heat of the moment but I would never hold this against him. Yes, it is awkward to ask but hey... we can joke about it :)

I do not feel that I am a fool for conducting myself this way as I have yet to meet a selfish jerk who would even try to get away with it LOL (Besides...I am trained in Tae Kwon Do...try me LOL)

[roamingguy 300292]

I do not feel that I am a fool for conducting myself this way as I have yet to meet a selfish jerk who would even try to get away with it LOL (Besides...I am trained in Tae Kwon Do...try me LOL)

 

Tae Kwon Do...wow, that could add another dimension in an encounter with you...and all you have to do is not pay.

How rough do you play Meg

BTW just kidding, I pay up front, as you know

RG

[RobX 2084]

I guess I need to ask if you ever did pay her the money that you had forgotten? If so, how did she handle it when you did pay her, any issues? What is the relationship like now?

 

To clarify, I did have the fee in my pocket at the time, including the tip, and I gave it to her immediately. She was her usual pleasant self as we said goodbye, but I left thinking that the damage had been done. This just happened on Thursday, and our last contact with her reply to my email, so it's too early to tell whether there has been any lasting damage.

 

... I can imagine that if I forgot my donation, and I never would, that it would not be a game changer.

 

It would also be impossible for me to forget to bring the fee. Going to the ATM is part of my ritual before every appointment. I still get nervous before every appointment (I'm not sure if that ever goes away) and I find myself counting the money a few times before I arrive at the door.

 

...

It sounds like you have a good rapport with her. If you want to see her again, I'd say go for it and forget about what happened--just remember to pay her when you arrive!

 

I have definitely decided to see her again. As for paying when I arrive, she has previously mentioned in her posts that she does not require clients pay her in advance, so I would want to do so in an inconspicuous manner that doesn't make me seem unreliable in any way - ie. having to give it to her in advance in case I forget again. I thought that what I might do is make it a ritual to take the fee out of my pocket when undressing and leave it on her dresser where she can see it. At the end of the session I could pick it up and hand it to her, or just leave it there.

 

Don't worry about it. Other than the initial goof of forgetting to leave your fee ("oops!"), you handled everything perfectly -- paid when asked and apologized. You even sent an extra apology later. It's all good, problem solved, just like any little hiccup that can happen between two people....

 

This is the type of reply I was most hoping for!

 

Thanks everyone! I do feel better about it now, and am now more confident that we can put it behind us.

[Andee 220524]

Since I always take care of business first, I have not had that happen that someone forgot to pay me.

 

Call it donation, gift, or whatever, I get the money up front and that way there is no forgetting to get it at the end of the appointment.

[namssa 562]

Hi RobX, I think if anything you had just a bit of an awkward moment. I really would not read much into it, we all have had our "oops" moments with a lady. Especially if you have seen her before, or a fair number of times, it really is nothing to worry about.

 

 

I really have no problem at all paying up front if asked, especially if I have never seen the lady previous. If I find that paying up front is SOP, then so be it, no worries. Many ladies I see, after the first or second time, have no problems with the donation being given at the end of the session. If a lady is a good provider, then her product will stand the test. If you are an established pooner with a good reputation, there should not be any concerns that the donation will be given after services have been given.

[Katherine of Halifax 113932]

A couple of months ago I had a gentleman visit me form Montreal. He paid me up front and I could tell there was a card in the envelope, how nice.

 

After he left I opend his card and then realized the envelope was a bit short. It was not enough for me to care about one way or the other so I just put it out of my mind. In a few hours the phone rang and there was my client "freaking " out that he had shorted me. He found spare cash in his wallet and realized it was to have gone in my envelope.

 

He then proceeded to drive 30 minutes in a cab to pay me the difference even though I said it was fine. For me it was plenty that he cared enough to call and make ammends. At any rate he came out here post haste and cound not have been nicer .

 

Thank you to my Montreal sweetie, that was such a nice thing for you to do and I hope if you visit my area again you will chose to visit me.

[stevecurious 42059]

When I see a lady whom I have never met before or one who I have only seen on a limited basis I always take care of the envelope first thing. This allows me to proceed with a clear head and no guilty conscience if I ever forgot it. I must say I agree with Pete in that ladies who I have a strong relationship with the envelope is often left until our parting kiss. I realize that in cases such as this it is due to a level of trust that I have been given and I do not take that trust lightly. If I were to ever to short change a lady or God forbid forget the envelop entirely I would be mortified! To me "the envelope" is a matter of trust and honesty, when a lady trusts me enough to kiss me first and allow me to hand her her gift at a less intimate moment I am honoured.

[Studio 110 by Sophia 150333]

This has happened on a number of occasions to me as well. Sometimes, I am the one who forgets as well! I never worry about it when it happens. There have been times they would leave and either of us even notices till they are long gone down the road. I have never had anyone on purpose do this to me, thankfully! I trust my clientel, I have them visit me at home. Perhaps the chemistry was just so good, the gift had slipped our mind, and that is a good thing! I simply e-mail, or PM and remind them. But yes, it is uncomfortable to have to ask for it. Also uncomfortable for them too I would Imagine. But we are only human and mistakes happen.

[stevecurious 42059]

He then proceeded to drive 30 minutes in a cab to pay me the difference even though I said it was fine.

 

A thirty minute drive is not long at all when you are the destination Cathy!

 

Perhaps the chemistry was just so good, the gift had slipped our mind, and that is a good thing!

 

The best type of chemistry is the type that makes you forget and I imagine you are quite the chemist Sophia!

[Boomer 33202]

I have on occasion forgotten with friends I've seen on a fairly regular basis. Usually all it takes is a question like , " Have you forgotten anything?"

 

They are quite aware that it's unintentional and that I'd be back to take care of it anyway.

[Guest f***2f***]

Yeah I did this once too and it was with a gal I see a lot. We just kind of got carried away and once the blood started leaving the big head for the little head I was a goner. I realized when I got to my car that I still had her envelope so I phoned her right away. She had time before her next client so I doubled back and gave it to her with a thousand apologies.

She sees me a lot so it wasn't a biggie...she knew it wasn't intentional and that I was good to make it up to her. Don't sweat it.

[Katherine of Halifax 113932]

Ah Steve thank you, you are such a darling. You could mail me my gift long after our date and it would be fine. Gentlemen like you don't happen along every day and I am so grateful for you.

xoxo

[fortunateone 156618]

Again, I'm with AofO, why put yourself (and her) into that position. You without cash, which would easily have been known had she had the very sound biz practise of pay before play.

 

It is all very well to see the sps counter with how much they don't mind, or they are showing trust to their clients, or established rapport and trust, but that is just advertising diplomacy. As a client, you should be prepared, and mindful, and pay up front regardless of what you may or may not think her site says, or she even tells you to your face. She is being diplomatic, imo, not trying to appear stressed or concerned, to break the illusion or fantasy.

 

But the reality is that is it regular and long time clients that most often "forget" to include the correct amount, or assume if they are short that paying a few days later should be "ok", as in they show up knowing they don't have the funds, and there are more examples to be sure.

 

And, as with AofO, I have never once been short changed, paid later, or had the donation "forgotten" and/or had to ask for it at the end, because everything is taken care of before.

 

Why would anyone think that having had a great and relaxing time, to hand over a bunch of cash in or out of an envelope, with that kiss at the end, isn't somehow wrecking the illusion. why not part without that image in your mind as you leave, with luck so much fun has been had that by the time you pay (at the beginning) to the time you leave, the whole concept of paying has left your mind altogether. To be rudely reminded of it at the end, that just seems awkward and obvious lol.

 

But yes, given the examples of the ones who have been shortchanged, and the ones who rely on the client to pay afterward and they don't have the funds, well, yes, I have to stick to my claim that this is a foolish move. In this business. It may be ok or appropriate in other businesses. It may be ok or appropriate if the sp is working at an mp, where it is obvious they have backup, other employees or reception to help them out, but indy and on their own, no, it is imo actually an unprofessional way to deal with clients. It actually makes it more difficult for the pay before sps to deal with clients who get that sort of after play treatment. It allows the predators to seek out the pay after play sps, for the specific purpose of shorting them or leaving without payment.

 

It might be difficult for some to bring up the topic but unless and until you do, and if the client can cooperate as well knowing that these things happen, and just do it that way 100% of the time for all sps, then perhaps she will learn from that and make it her policy. typically the sps who say things are "ok" when they are talking to clients, or publically like this, don't mean it is ok to not have the money on you, to not have come prepared lol. But what other sort of response do you expect? To have them freak out, swear at you, throw things at you, and kick you in the butt on your way out, then call you 15 times until you show up with the funds?

 

I don't think so. Like other things, she will smile, say that's ok, and cross her fingers that you are not "one of those lessons" she had to learn.

[Kubrickfan 12836]

As to the original poster's point, I think you are feeling too guilty about an honest mistake and you took the trouble to apologize. The ultimately test is probably whetehre the lady will see you again and, based on what I have read above, I suspect she definitely would. Dont be so hard on yourself.

 

I think this is a really easy issue to avoid by ALWAYS having the contribution in an unsealed envelope with the ladies name on it on the coffee table or other area where you sit to talk before she arrives. It is different when you have seen a lady many times because there's trust. Heck, I suspect some of the ladies here are close enough to their customers to have a line of credit, so to speak.

[Gabriella Laurence 301887]

Why would anyone think that having had a great and relaxing time, to hand over a bunch of cash in or out of an envelope, with that kiss at the end, isn't somehow wrecking the illusion. why not part without that image in your mind as you leave, with luck so much fun has been had that by the time you pay (at the beginning) to the time you leave, the whole concept of paying has left your mind altogether.

 

I couldn't agree more with you!