Etiquette Question - Tipping

[Incognito 331]

Gents (and Ladies)

 

Here's another newbie question but probably everyone is interested to see what you think on this topic.

 

Obviously all of us are aware of the notion of tipping for great service received, however tipping often has customary practices that are unique to the surrounding circumstances.

 

What are the 'best practices' re: tipping in the SP space? For example...

 

- always tip except in the face of worse possible service (like tipping in a restaurant)

 

- only tip if the service was 'blow you away' good (Not a BJ pun!)

 

- never tip because the donations are "all inclusive" (this would seem unlikely to me)

 

And lastly, is tipping generally percentage based (like a waiter or a cab) or a fixed amount based, or whatever you think it was worth based?

 

Sorry to bring up money when so many more fun topics are at hand, but these Ladies deserve Best Practice and personally, I definitely do not want to miss the mark on this important point.

 

Thanks in advance for all of your thoughts.

[d*mm*y 887]

Good questions, SP's are different than MP in that they get paid up front. There is a service expectation with the amount paid and that is discussed when paying at the beginning of the session. If you are really impressed with the value than repeat with that SP, if you don't intend on repeating because for some reason, than tip in advance then you get your mileage. It is not a general practice to tip after service with an SP, I may from time to time buy them a gift if I see them regularly.

[Incognito 331]

Dummpy...

 

So the way to show true appreciation is not by tipping AFTER the service, but instead to repeat. OMG!!! Now I have to go back and repeat with all of those fantastic ladies. What if they are FABULOUS the second time too (and of course they will be)? Then do I have to repeat a third time? Damn! Are we having fun yet or what???

[PistolPete 61421]

I agree with Dummpy's answer, to look at from a perspective you drop $$$ 1st visit, and than $$$ 2nd visit and those may only be 1 hour visits. I think your payment really includes a tip.Now, I have gone on record in prior threads, I try to bring flowers on my visits, if the florist is open! as I generally take early morning appointments...(I like to be the first man of the day). I think it really helps the mood when we first meet, and its a nice gesture, woman do like flowers. I have also bought and brought massage oil/sex toy's to the provider and left her with the gifts for the next time, or she can use for herself. I try to remember that meeting a SP is first date, so you try to settle your nerves down by playing with the toys or taking in some compliments about the flowers.

[Incognito 331]

PistolPete

 

Looks like concensus is forming here. I also like the idea of bringing along a little 'something'.

 

Ladies... what do you say?

[kih 458]

This is an interesting subject; I'm interested what the ladies have to say in this regard.

[imwildru 100]

I rather bring something with me than tipping over what been agreed on, in my opinion tipping more means there is hidding cost and might expect it of me every time and $$ becomes $$ & half so on and so forth, as it mentioned here i would rather visit the SP more as a show of appreciation rather than tipping her once and never go back again and that way i might get better service since we have met before. thats my thought:rolleyes:.

[kih 458]

After viewing websites, my general consensus is that some of the ladies websites have covered this subject. Some prefer that a donation to a specified charity in lieu. Other ladies remain silent and some accept the gratuity or extra gift. In all, I think its going to vary depending on the particular lady.

[cat 262460]

Ahhh, the ?tipping? debate! I noticed there was a decided void in SP response so I will take a minute to share my thoughts?

 

From an agency girl perspective, tipping is often a way to generate extra income because after they pay the agency and the driver, they usually end up on the short end of the stick. 10 years ago, I ran for an agency, we collected $260 for an hour, with $110 going to the house, $40-$100 to the driver depending on where the visit was located, which left me maximum of $110 with as little as $10 in my pocket. With a $15 book on fee and mandatory car cell phone fees of $25 per night, I needed 3 full fees per night to make working worthwhile, God forbid I get credit card calls, which somehow always worked out us getting nothing. We were not allowed to refuse a call so we had to find creative ways to ensure we were paid. Tipping for extra service was the only way to keep our heads above water. The nice thing was that we had a shift, we worked, and we went home and had a life. That said, it was unfair to the guest who would end up with less than what he expected because he was not prepared for the extra fees.

 

Independents are in a slightly different boat. We usually have a higher upfront fee, but we also assume ALL the costs incurred, which is far more than many realize. If we charged what we feel we should to get our ROI, the protests would be heard long and loud. Many Indies have a smaller bottom line than an ambitious girl at a well run agency. So when it comes to tips, many things need to be considered.

 

In the south, SP's are tipped much in the same manner as a restaurant. Anyone walking a restaurant wouldn?t consider walking out without leaving a tip if everything was satisfactory. I tip everyone in the service industry, from the girl who washes my hair, to the man at Suny?s who pumps my gas because a little bit from many adds up at the end of the day.

 

Flowers and trinkets are lovely in thought, but a girl can?t deposit wilted stems into an RRSP, and my bank doesn?t seem to take dildos, massage oil, garter belts or silk stockings on deposit -go figure! As Joyful C has so wisely stated, most SP?s live a fragile existence financially. We provide an illusion of playful luxury for our guests benefit, but rest assured, 90% of the time it is smoke and mirrors. Behind the scenes we struggle to pay our bills, put diapers on our babies and try to take care of those we love, all the while working on a way to get to a normal existence if that does in fact even exist.

 

An extra $20 from each client equals a full appointment by the end of the week, and at the end of the month that pays the cell phone, buys the groceries and lets us take the little ones away for the weekend after we have paid both rents (home and incall), all our advertising, babysitters, hydro, car repairs, personal maintenance and the same expenses everyone else has. Not to mention the monthly payments on augmentation, lifts, tucks and anything else to keep us up to the exceptionally high standards expected if we want to continue making money in this arena.

 

There are few SP?s who can keep up the daily client service to ensure long term financial viability in this business because of the emotional and physical toll this business extracts which sometimes means extended time offs to get our heads, hearts and bodies back in order. We have no paid holidays, benefits or paid personal days. If there is a crisis that forces us to take time off, we lose money and clients which often means we work regardless of illness, pain or any other of lifes challenges.

 

Each SP has her own reasons for working, but the universal element is that we all are trying to achieve some sort of financial stability. I never expect tips, and I can count on one hand how many I have received since my arrival in Canada because of the nature of the business here. Hate to tell you guys, but Canadian men are not known for their generous nature, they rank a close second to Germans in this realm (I think the outlandishly high taxes inflicted in both countries has something to do with it!). I would never expect a tip from guests that have me on retainer, I see them weekly. But unless you are going to be a bankable commodity in a SP?s life, a tip relative to the quality of service is a sure way to say thank you and have her know you mean it...

 

Catherine

[kih 458]

Thank you Cat...well said. Your post gives a behind the scenes perspective.

[gentle-man 100]

Thank You for your perspective and information Cat. You make a lot of sense.

[Incognito 331]

When I asked the original question I really had no idea what the deal was here on this topic. Almost immediately there were thoughtful replies provided... gifts, repeat visits... all of which made great sense to me.

 

However I'd like to acknowledge Cat speaking out (quite unselfishly I'm sure; thinking of the other SP's as much or more than herself). I read her post more than once, just to make sure it all sunk in. Frankly, it all resonated with me.

 

Like some (many?) of you, I've had the priviledge of spending time with this wonderful lady and I truly appreciate the extraordinary efforts she goes to, to provide simply the best experience possible. And she is not the only one... this Board is legitimately full of praise for so many of the exceptional providers in our community.

 

After reading her post, I was going to suggest a % tip, but on second thought I don't it is right for me to do that; ie: to imply what anyone else should do.

 

But let's be cool about this and when the service is exceptional as it so often is, let's each of us - in our own way - let these ladies know we appreciate them and what they do.

 

Just my 2cents

[PistolPete 61421]

"Flowers and trinkets are lovely in thought, but a girl can?t deposit wilted stems into an RRSP, and my bank doesn?t seem to take dildos, massage oil, garter belts or silk stockings on deposit -go figure! "

Darling Cat, not to get into a confrontation over the great debate of tipping, but maybe you did not understand my thread. SP's at 300 for a hour, I may buy a gift or continue as a regular client which is excellent for them. SP's that are less than that mark I'll tip. Yes you can't roll up wilted stems into RRSP, but it is certainly was my thought that counted..now wasn't it?

[cat 262460]

"Flowers and trinkets are lovely in thought, but a girl can?t deposit wilted stems into an RRSP, and my bank doesn?t seem to take dildos, massage oil, garter belts or silk stockings on deposit -go figure! "

 

Darling Cat, not to get into a confrontation over the great debate of tipping, but maybe you did not understand my thread. SP's at 300 for a hour, I may buy a gift or continue as a regular client which is excellent for them. SP's that are less than that mark I'll tip. Yes you can't roll up wilted stems into RRSP, but it is certainly was my thought that counted..now wasn't it?

 

 

Darling Pistol Pete,

If you reread my thread, you will see I made allowances for those of you who are bankable. Your continued support to the SP's in Ottawa is exceptional as your posts show. The information was directed at the other 90% of the board who simply read and don't post. The ones that dabble, see someone occasionally and will tie up time with email for weeks trying to decide who to see, figure out the rules and understand.

Regardless of the amount of the consideration, if a guest is not going to be a reliable client, and the service is there, a tip in place of a gift is always preferable. I have thrown out boxes of chocolates, underwear that don't fit, and composted flowers thinking that the $ could have been better spent if handed to me.

I have many a guest who could show up with an IOU in an envelope and they would still leave smiling, for they have proven to me time and again they genuinely care. It isn't the money per say, it is the understanding of our situations that dictate whether a gift shows true insight and caring. If what a girl really needs is to put up her tuition or put braces on her child, do toys really help that along? If you know your SP, you will know what is really important to her, and your choice of tip can reflect that.

Catherine

[d*mm*y 887]

Darling Pistol Pete,

 

...........

 

I have many a guest who could show up with an IOU in an envelope and they would still leave smiling, for they have proven to me time and again they genuinely care. It isn't the money per say, it is the understanding of our situations that dictate whether a gift shows true insight and caring. If what a girl really needs is to put up her tuition or put braces on her child, do toys really help that along? If you know your SP, you will know what is really important to her, and your choice of tip can reflect that.

 

Catherine

 

I think this is the key, I am the first to admit when a gift is for me or for the SP, lotions toys novelty clothes are for me and the fact the SP lets me use them enhances the experience. Gifts I have given that I feel are for them include laptops, shopping trips to Ikea, nice outfits with gift receipt that they can where in public or return if the money is better appreciated. Then there are the frivolous gifts that you give a long term SP because you know them well, a special flower that has some meaning, a special food that again is mutually known and shows you remember (Hot dog with mayonnaise!) or a special wine, these gifts only gain meaning after time together.

 

In the end cold hard cash is often my choice over and over, if you want someone to really know you appreciate them hand them an envelope with a dozen brown bills!

[antlerman 17064]

In the end cold hard cash is often my choice over and over, if you want someone to really know you appreciate them hand them an envelope with a dozen brown bills!

 

I need to feel appreciated dummpy...really I do!:D

[cat 262460]

I think the bottom line on this is that SP's do not expect a gratuity, and when one is recieved, the thought is always appreciated. In a society where SP's are given no validation publicly, it falls to those who use our services to give us a pat on the back sometimes.

My guests have often heard me say that I am blessed because incredible people seem to fall in my lap, and that is the real "thank you". Ottawa is full of men who embrace us as we are, for who we are and show us they care in a multitude of ways. I give everything I can to my guests because I know the ultimate sense of satisfaction that comes from knowing I have put 100% into a situation. Over the years, I have found that people respond in spades and Ottawa is no exception.

My input to this thread was not a demand for more money, but simply to let people know that girls in our situations really, truly appreciate the little extra, if you have it to give. If not, please know a genuine, heartfelt thank you is more than enough.

My hat is off to the gentlemen of this board for their input and their willingness to discuss something sticky like this without getting their tigglies in a wink.

I salute you!

Catherine

[d*mm*y 887]

Of course antlerman, one dozen Sandy McTire's coming right up!

 

 

 

I need to feel appreciated dummpy...really I do!:D

[loneskater 25635]

Of course antlerman, one dozen Sandy McTire's coming right up!

 

A dozen!!! Wow that is appreciation. He can probably get a SCREWdriver for that.

[capitalman 3861]

One day I got a really bad haircut from the barber that I've been going to for years. I told my buddy and he said "Do you tip him?" I said "What? No. He's a barber. He's a got a sign on the door that says $10, that's what it costs man, that's what I pay him."

 

We decided the barber was telling me I should tip him, so he gave me a bad haircut. It was like something from a Seinfeld episode. Anyhow, my next haircut I tipped him a couple of dollars. I've never had a bad haircut since (and this is years later, like 10 maybe) and when I'm there I notice some guys get a 15 minute cut but I always get a longer time in the chair and he goes over my hair many times to make sure it's just right. I always tip him now too.

 

I work in a service profession too, I'm a contractor. I don't get sick leave, I don't get paid if I'm injured, I don't get paid holidays or days off either. I don't get tips either. Usually I get grief, people complaining I'm charging too much, even if I laid out the terms and price up front. I get repeat customers, they're the good ones...but again they don't tip. Maybe a gift and I'm always grateful...always!

 

I have cell phone bills, car expenses, special expensive clothing, website bills...you get the picture, just like an SP...but I don't make $300 hour and yet somehow I manage to live fine. I feed my kids and wear a nice watch and have a roof over my head.

 

I'm not convinced we should be tipping just for the sake of tipping, like we tip in a restaurant...no way. But if the service is exeptional, better than you expected, then go for it, tip away...and who cares if you do it as you leave. It might be uncomfortable but the SP won't care when she's counting it. Just my 2 cents, thanks.

[cat 262460]

One day I got a really bad haircut from the barber that I've been going to for years. I told my buddy and he said "Do you tip him?" I said "What? No. He's a barber. He's a got a sign on the door that says $10, that's what it costs man, that's what I pay him."

 

We decided the barber was telling me I should tip him, so he gave me a bad haircut. It was like something from a Seinfeld episode. Anyhow, my next haircut I tipped him a couple of dollars. I've never had a bad haircut since (and this is years later, like 10 maybe) and when I'm there I notice some guys get a 15 minute cut but I always get a longer time in the chair and he goes over my hair many times to make sure it's just right. I always tip him now too.

 

I work in a service profession too, I'm a contractor. I don't get sick leave, I don't get paid if I'm injured, I don't get paid holidays or days off either. I don't get tips either. Usually I get grief, people complaining I'm charging too much, even if I laid out the terms and price up front. I get repeat customers, they're the good ones...but again they don't tip. Maybe a gift and I'm always grateful...always!

 

I have cell phone bills, car expenses, special expensive clothing, website bills...you get the picture, just like an SP...but I don't make $300 hour and yet somehow I manage to live fine. I feed my kids and wear a nice watch and have a roof over my head.

 

I'm not convinced we should be tipping just for the sake of tipping, like we tip in a restaurant...no way. But if the service is exeptional, better than you expected, then go for it, tip away...and who cares if you do it as you leave. It might be uncomfortable but the SP won't care when she's counting it. Just my 2 cents, thanks.

 

Dear capitalman,

 

There are so many aspects of your post that on the surface ring true, but when the reality is examined shows the extreme differences between our professions. Comparing the life of a SP to any other business is not feasible. Yes, you have the same kind of overhead that we do, but you do not face the challenges that SP's do. It's important you have a clear understanding of the challenges we face before you start the comparison.

 

Many of us independents are parents, have other jobs that do not pay the bills, but we have to maintain them to ensure we do not lose our children to the state, or have our teenage children put in a compromising "living off the avails" situation. Most of us have to sacrifice our personal lives in it's entirety to conduct our business as it needs to be if we are independent. As SP's we have a limited run, working extracts tolls that most cannot even imagine. As I have stated in previous posts, this is like the career of the professional athlete, you can only do it for so long before it does permanent, irreparable damage. For some it is a physical manifestation, but for most it is mental. It can and will leave scars on each and every SP in some way, and most are not equipped to deal with the fallout. You on the other hand, can continue to be a contractor until you decide to retire which gives you 30 some odd years to build and run your business and make your mark. SP's do not have that luxury, unless we are blessed with titanium inner strength and the good fortune to have a partner who shares our backbone. It's easier to find a 10 carat diamond in the Gatineau river, than a partner who can accept an SP's line of work.

 

This is a line of work where we share the most intimate part of ourselves daily with complete strangers. The energy expended to ensure our guests leave feeling good is enormous. Even a legend like dummpy visits a maximum of one provider per day, we can see up to 5 or 6 guests maximum and that is a WOW day. Most of our time is spent in preparation, and when I average my day, I make about $22 an hour. Not bad for a country hick with no education. But it will be over at some point, what then? We move on, but unless we have invested the money we are back where we started. Most of us have bills to pay which is why we are working in this industry to begin with. SP's don't wake up one day and decide to go hustle. We choose it because our backs are against the wall and we have no other option. I have spent close to $250K on lawyers in the last 7 years because of the industry I am in. My RRSP's are lower than other women my age and my finacial future is entirely dependent on my ability to generate an income.

 

Try for a minute to imagine what it is like to open the door to people you have never met, and take them into yourself. Over and over and over again. Now imagine the reality that many will have issues you find distasteful. Perhaps the hygiene is questionable, or his attitude is demeaning. He pinches and bites a bit too hard and leaves marks, or is too aggressive and leaves you sore and swollen. What if he is first for the day? Every guest after that just makes it worse, and even if they are someone you know and enjoy, it's hard to grit your teeth and not have them know you are in pain. Just think....

 

So when it comes to tipping, think about the entire scenario and the PERSON who has just made you smile. Realize the effort she puts in and acknowledge it, even if it is only an email saying thank you. $ will always be appreciated, but just knowing that someone gives kudos for a job well done is often enough...

 

Catherine

[shypilot 113]

Nicely put Catherine, it is too easy to look at what you do as just another business and you are so right.

 

I am willing to bet not too many of us on here would be willing to put ourselves in your position my self included. We do need to be reminded about the cost of doing business goes well beyond the monetary.

 

I personally believe it is always important to let the sp know how much I appreciate their efforts and in truth that applies to any person I deal with. It does make a difference.

[capitalman 3861]

Thanks Cat. You're right. I'm not going to say I'm wrong, because I don't think I am completely, but you're right.

 

I shouldn't try to compare SP's to other lines of work, it's unique that's for sure. I'm sorry if I offend.

 

I guess I'm just trying to say every line of work is unique in its own way and does uniqueness warrant a tip? I don't know...who knows. Does my friggin' barber deserve a tip every time? NO...but I do it anyways, because I'm now in the habit. I can't turn back now! Every so often the barber opens the cash register and pulls a big twenty out and dumps a handful of toonies from his pocket. The guy probably makes more in tips in a day than his net income from cutting hair! I'm insanely jealous. There, the truth is out! :-)

[Guest Honey'zMia (Account closed by request)]

Honestly, I love repeat clients but that's just not an option sometimes, I always appreciate an extra 20 so I know I did a good job.

You don't HAVE to tip all the time, but if she did good, then she did good guys!!

[cat 262460]

There certainly was no offense taken, this is a place to discuss these things and see another?s point of view. There is no right or wrong of it. It simply is. Every occupation has its own distinct challenges, and when it comes to finding the best of the best, it is always a scavenger hunt. In every profession there are those that simply show up, do their job and go home. Then there are the ones that put the effort in to become exceptional and those are the ones we all search for. A barber is an excellent example. If you want the extras, the tip is mandatory. It isn't the extra couple of dollars you leave that motivate him to do a masterful job; it's knowing you appreciate the effort and the results. My hairstylist could double his fees and I would pay it, because he is the best I have found for me and I wouldn't want to try and find someone else. It is a risk I am unwilling to take; my hair is part of how I make my living. If I were willing to risk having my tresses butchered a couple of times I could probably find someone else, but the grow out is long and painful. Been there, done that, not doing it again. So many out there wallow in a mundane existence and never notice the little things, and we all need the recognition that we are doing a good job. Thus the "tip"?

 

What I think has been missed out on in this thread is the symbology of the "tip". In some professions like waitressing, it is their bread and butter. For others in the service industry it is a thank you. But what does a "tip" say about the tipper? The way a person tips sends signals loud and clear about a person?s character. Someone who is "tight" shall we say sends out a message that they are constricted, adverse to letting go or taking a risk. In the game of seduction it is the ultimate anti-seducer. We are all cheaper than we think, and often float thru life without realizing the message we send is that we are closed off. Having a giving nature blankets someone?s entire being. Someone who shares willingly will do so in all areas of their lives. It means you are not afraid to give of yourself and that will carry you further in this world than just about anything else.

 

In the world of science, quantum physics has proven that thoughts physically manifest themselves and what we think can become real. Having a generous nature means the world will be generous back. I have experienced this first hand; it is a truth that has proven itself time and time again in my life. While money is a good way to gauge someone?s nature, selective gen♣♣♣♣ity is always a good rule to apply. People can give without hurting their wallets; all it takes is a little willingness to open up to others. I never worry about a tip when I have a guest who comes to me with his spirit open and giving. Those that arrive with walls that need to be dismantled one brick at a time seldom, if ever get invited back regardless of a tip. Everything we say, every action we take sends out messages and we need to be aware of what the message we are sending is. The money simply symbolizes recognition and appreciation, and helps alleviate some of the day to day stresses that preoccupy the mind. Just my thoughts on it...

 

Catherine