An Interview With... Ava Marie Love - Avoiding Toxicity On Boards

[Guest lydiahardwood]

Happy Sunday everyone! Today's interview is with a lovely Companion I've had the pleasure of chatting to quite a bit via Twitter. She has a wealth of knowledge surrounding the industry and here are some of her thoughts about keeping toxicity at bay on boards.

 

Q: Hey @Ava Maria Love. Thanks for agreeing to do this interview with me. I’m always taking note of what you say on Twitter so it’s great to get the chance to talk to you in more detail. First of all, can you tell me about yourself and what you do? How long have you been in the industry for?

A: Originally I worked as an Agency Escort for a couple years and left the industry coming back later as a Certified Massage therapist offering FBSM and Tantra massage 7 years ago. I crossed over to Companionship just 3 years ago .

 A: Q: I’m not one for beating around the bush and I know you aren’t either, so, shall we talk review boards? I know you’re very vocal on this topic on social media. So, in a nutshell, tell me your thoughts.

A: From what I have read, when review boards began it was a much needed part of the industry to keep both ladies and clients safe. Unfortunately there will always be a few unscrupulous people in the world that take advantage of others, so review boards saw a niche market where they could post warnings for safety purposes and bad dates where physical safety was threatened. This also made a place where both could connect and form bonds and community. A place to advertise and chat on forums with other like minded people. 

Reviews of service were meant to be  a way for clients to verify that a lady did in fact do what was offered on her ad, but this truly is a YMMV services based on many factors i.e. hygiene. The reviews devolved into some very graphic personal assaults on women's looks and value as human beings and Hobbyists attempted to control the industry and destroy ladies they have sometimes never meet, running ladies out of the business or forcing women to do acts they are not comfortable with, due to the fear of a bad review.

Q: I remember seeing your tweets and honestly agreeing with what you were saying - they can be toxic places to be for sure. Can you give me some examples of toxic behaviour you’ve witnessed?

A: The use of term like WOT (waste of time) and WOM (waste of money), very derogatory comments over a person's physical appearance in highly graphic detail right down to the appearance of a person's body parts including genitals, and accusations of mental illness, threats to run specific ladies out of business, ageist, sexist, misogynistic, and vulgar language. 

 Q: In your experience, do review boards listen to SPs and their feedback?

A: In my experience some boards value their male members over their advertisers, they charge ladies to have access to private SP lounges where ladies go to learn about safety notices. They do not take into account that Providers support their boards by paid for advertising. Or they only take feedback from certain ladies making that board biased in favour of specific ladies or business models in the industry. 
While others are very unbiased and open to working with both SPs and client’s to find a common ground and agreement where both are happy.

Q: What would you want to see from a board for you to use them? 

A: No vulgar or graphic details in reviews.
Not a place of fighting, arguing and debating, but respectful conversation.
Access to SP private areas for free, as if the intention is to keep ladies safe then that should not be charged for. I agree with charging for advertising, but all Providers in the industry should be welcome to safe havens unless they have a history of not being safe regarding their peers and colleagues.

Q: I’ve realised that a lot of people didn’t realise we have a private SP area here on Lyla. I’m pleased to say it’s getting busier these days. How important is an area like this to you? 

A: Extremely important, that is the number one reason I have ever joined any board, again this should be free 

Q: Do you think that toxic review board culture can negatively impact Clients? How?

A: 100%. Many of the most prolific posters who consistently post negativity scare clients away from the industry or certain experiences they  might have enjoyed, many get so confused trying to stay safe that they are paranoid based on untrue posts and constant negativity.

Q: What do you think stops a review or recommendation from being toxic? 

A: I think a good fair and unbiased review will not contain graphic details regarding any part of the person or the encounter, i.e. physical tributes, personal opinions over specific details and service.
Also labels that are negative i.e. WOT WOM (waste of time / waste of money) as previously mentioned, there is no need for this. Or assessments regarding a person's mental state - a lady or a client might have a bad day. That does not make them a bad person. And absolutely no chiming in by the “gang”, no double posting, no comments from the “crowd" who have never booked or met.

Q: Noted! Can you give me some examples of what we can do to advocate against toxicity in the industry?

Run by fair unbiased Admins and Mods. Recognition of the fundamental worth and dignity of every person. Respect for the equality of all persons. Acceptance of the necessity of compromise.

Q: Thanks so much for your time, I really appreciate it Ava 🙂 Anything else you’d like to add?

A: I am really impressed by your commitment to SPs safety by having a free access to the SP area. That you care about clients and what can help make there experience within the industry better. Also the fact that you are very open to discussion and very careful not to gossip. Any review/recommendation board is only as good as the Admins, as they set the tone and are the role models for all members.

[NotchJohnson 214123]

Thank you @lydiahardwood for inviting @Ava Maria Love to tell us her opinion on social media pros and cons.  It was very interesting. to read.

[StephanieMystique 1892]

Thank you for putting this together! 

 

This is a great read and I look forward to having you apart of Lyla @Ava Maria Love. Your voice and passion will be a great contribute to moving Lyla to be the space we all want it to be. 

 

[Guest]

This was a good read. Thanks very much.

[Allie Zeon 2925]

Can’t agree more!!!!!

[Ava Maria Love 72]

THANK YOU @lydiahardwood for giving me a voice , and a warm welcome your site .

 

and thank you to @NotchJohnson @StephanieMystique @500 Pound Gorilla @Allie Zeon for taking the time to read and share yout thoughts .

it is nice to be a member of a community like this one here on Lyla ,

where I am able to share my opinions , without having to fear personal attack . 

[Mikeyboy 27133]

Another well done interview. Thank you @Ava Maria Love for highlighting this important topic and thank you @lydiahardwood for helping to keep this site a civil and enjoyable place to be. 

[Phaedrus 209521]

Thanks, @Ava Maria Love - it's great to get a provider's perspective on this stuff, especially given how unpopular boards seem to be in general.

Whenever I see boards mentioned there does seem to be a general approach from providers that "all boards are toxic". I can see why people would say that, but it's good to know that not everyone believes it. Boards can choose to be as toxic (or not) as they like, depending on what the people running them choose to allow.

11 hours ago, lydiahardwood said:

Q: I’ve realised that a lot of people didn’t realise we have a private SP area here on Lyla. I’m pleased to say it’s getting busier these days. How important is an area like this to you? 

A: Extremely important, that is the number one reason I have ever joined any board, again this should be free

 

This is very good news; if we have more SPs coming for this, maybe a few of them will feel inclined to post in the main board while they're here...

[waterat 20911]

First off, a thanks to @Ava Maria Love for sharing her thoughts and insights with us and, again, to @lydiahardwood for conducting these interviews, This one gets directly to what I feel is the heart of the lyla community.

On 4/11/2021 at 5:14 AM, lydiahardwood said:

Q: What would you want to see from a board for you to use them? 

A: No vulgar or graphic details in reviews.
Not a place of fighting, arguing and debating, but respectful conversation.
Access to SP private areas for free, as if the intention is to keep ladies safe then that should not be charged for. I agree with charging for advertising, but all Providers in the industry should be welcome to safe havens unless they have a history of not being safe regarding their peers and colleagues.

Q: I’ve realised that a lot of people didn’t realise we have a private SP area here on Lyla. I’m pleased to say it’s getting busier these days. How important is an area like this to you? 

A: Extremely important, that is the number one reason I have ever joined any board, again this should be free 

Q: Do you think that toxic review board culture can negatively impact Clients? How?

A: 100%. Many of the most prolific posters who consistently post negativity scare clients away from the industry or certain experiences they  might have enjoyed, many get so confused trying to stay safe that they are paranoid based on untrue posts and constant negativity.

The answers to these three questions all identify the merits of lyla that deserve our support and engagement.

#1 Benefits of lyla membership identified. I'm assuming advertising is still free on lyla - in the past, agencies and massage businesses (and the providers who worked there) were charged some sort of 'commercial' membership fee - identified by a username in red. @Yourfrenchlady (company account) is the only example I've noticed and I think that's a recent change. Many of my local SWs stopped visiting lyla as they rarely had 'traffic' generated from the site so I doubt it's sensible to charge for advertising but with more recommendations, more advertisers and more respectful discussion; the value of this 'non-toxic' recommendation board would be enhanced.

#2 Boom!

#3 I notice this sliding into the lyla forum mostly due to clients who haven't done their homework, have unrealistic expectations and simply import toxic review board culture. The source of much of this comes to us via leolist which, while having some sort of a business relationship with lyla, is not our friend.

I don't mean to step away from the thanks expressed in initiating this comment, nor as a hijack, but to promote some discussion.

Cheers, waterat

[Phaedrus 209521]

6 hours ago, waterat said:

#3 I notice this sliding into the lyla forum mostly due to clients who haven't done their homework, have unrealistic expectations and simply import toxic review board culture. The source of much of this comes to us via leolist which, while having some sort of a business relationship with lyla, is not our friend.

I don't think this is new, particularly. You get this sort of thing with any online community (or real life one, for that matter); some people take the time to read/listen and get a feel for what the community is like before they engage, and some people just make assumptions and jump right in, and some just don't even realize this sort of thing is an issue. The latter types are the ones that there's issues with - either they think they can get away with the same shit they pull elsewhere, or they just don't have a clue what's OK and what isn't - but they generally either get straightened out reasonably quickly, or figure out they're in the wrong place and leave... or leave with a bit of assistance :)

[Ava Maria Love 72]

Thank you  @Mikeyboy @clearbluesky15 @Phaedrus @waterat  For the time and attention you have given to my interview .

 

@Mikeyboy  I am so with you in the appreciation of @lydiahardwoodit is so nice to have found a board that is a civil and positive place , without the toxicity that a few boards have . It is truly refreshing .

 

@clearbluesky15 Yes I agreee it is important for both client and Service providers to remain open to discussion in this civil way to facilitate learning how to be better as Providers as well as clients too .

 

@Phaedrus I am sorry to admit that a few people have mistaken me for one of those ladys, the "all boards are toxic" type , but that has never been my beleif or attitude  . My mind does not paint in broad brush strokes , generalizations or stereotypes, I was fortunate last summer to use the London Sugar board in Ontario and the Caf board in Calgary , on my cross Canada Tour , and I did enjoy both of those boards . I looked forward to beng on the east coast and being active here on Lyla .

I was attempting to go coast to coast but , the East Coast was closed or I would have been active in the maritimes for a few weeks , one day I will make it . 

 

@waterat #1 thank you so much for such a great reply , first point , Love learning all of this , it is brillant.

#2 Boom ! , YAY!!!

#3 you pretty much summed up what a lot of newbie or ( urgent ) clients do to thi own determent . They simply rush the process and or settle then post negativity that is often unwarranted ,  if they did thier  homework they would not get scammed and or find a better fit .

I need help with  the "Leolist is not our friend " ? part of your  comment ?,I love Leolist I am legit and reputable , and I think my ad stands out as so on there, so I love how easy it is to screen the men contacting  me from there , by thier approach lol , its not hard to tell the men that did not do thier homework ,so I kindly educate them , so they can be better clients for me or other ladys in the future .

Whew I did it , was kinda nervous , I have often and recently had my words twisted beyond reognition, so I do have a little apprehension and anxiety replying to new people . BARE lol with me , nothing I say is ever written in stone , I reserve the right to change my mind , and break the unspoken internet law of including typos lol wink wink .

 

 

 

 

 

[Ava Maria Love 72]

22 hours ago, Phaedrus said:

I don't think this is new, particularly. You get this sort of thing with any online community (or real life one, for that matter); some people take the time to read/listen and get a feel for what the community is like before they engage, and some people just make assumptions and jump right in, and some just don't even realize this sort of thing is an issue. The latter types are the ones that there's issues with - either they think they can get away with the same shit they pull elsewhere, or they just don't have a clue what's OK and what isn't - but they generally either get straightened out reasonably quickly, or figure out they're in the wrong place and leave... or leave with a bit of assistance 🙂

I love this post , I wish it was a tweet I could retweet into the Universe and make it go Viral!

[Phaedrus 209521]

On 4/13/2021 at 11:48 PM, Ava Maria Love said:

 

@Phaedrus I am sorry to admit that a few people have mistaken me for one of those ladys, the "all boards are toxic" type , but that has never been my beleif or attitude  . My mind does not paint in broad brush strokes , generalizations or stereotypes, I was fortunate last summer to use the London Sugar board in Ontario and the Caf board in Calgary , on my cross Canada Tour , and I did enjoy both of those boards . I looked forward to beng on the east coast and being active here on Lyla .

I was attempting to go coast to coast but , the East Coast was closed or I would have been active in the maritimes for a few weeks , one day I will make it .

I get the feeling that these people have been on (or seen what happens on) boards, and just decided they don't want any part of that scene. Which is a shame.

On 4/13/2021 at 11:50 PM, Ava Maria Love said:

I love this post , I wish it was a tweet I could retweet into the Universe and make it go Viral!

Thanks!

Actually, for me this is probably the thing I like most about boards: we can have this sort of conversation. The main alternative for communication these days seems to be Twitter, and you just don't get it there. There's a lot of stuff which is too complex or nuanced to go into a tweet. And the other problem with Twitter is that anything you say kinda disappears into the void very quickly; it flies though people's timelines and then... nobody will ever see it, unless they make a point of going to your profile to see what you've been saying. But here, I can respond to a post from five days ago as easily as one from five minutes ago, and I don't miss stuff that happened when I wasn't online.

[Brendin 1]

Hi 

[Onceinawhile 1126]

Thank you @Ava Maria Love and @lydiahardwood this was a great interview and an interesting read on review boards.

All I can say is that I am thankfull we have a great review board here for both service providers and clients.

[Kitten 1281]

Oh @Ava Maria Love you hit so many important things in this interview and thank you for taking the time to join and share with us!

Toxicity is something I am not a fan of myself and why I prefer just to hide here in this little nook that is Lyla. It truly is a wonderful place.

I'm thrilled to have what seems to be another sweetheart around!

The views must be amazing on the west coast. You seem amazing and the type of mind I could get along with. If I am ever fortunate enough to make out that way I certainly hope we could have a drink sometime. Usually when I travel its East, but the West I do need to explore more.

When it's safe to do so of course.

Regretting I shutdown my Twitter. Have been considering getting it back up now that school is finished for the summer. If I do I hope you wouldn't mind if I send you a follow 💋

[Ava Maria Love 72]

15 hours ago, Kitten said:

Oh @Ava Maria Love you hit so many important things in this interview and thank you for taking the time to join and share with us!

Toxicity is something I am not a fan of myself and why I prefer just to hide here in this little nook that is Lyla. It truly is a wonderful place.

I'm thrilled to have what seems to be another sweetheart around!

The views must be amazing on the west coast. You seem amazing and the type of mind I could get along with. If I am ever fortunate enough to make out that way I certainly hope we could have a drink sometime. Usually when I travel its East, but the West I do need to explore more.

When it's safe to do so of course.

Regretting I shutdown my Twitter. Have been considering getting it back up now that school is finished for the summer. If I do I hope you wouldn't mind if I send you a follow 💋

 

 

Aw thank you , for your kind words , it would be my pleasure to meet and also to connect on twitter . 

I tried to come out east last summer , but could not enter , maybe next year ,since this summer seems too many lockdowns 😞 , Anything I can help you with regarding the westcoast just ask away .