The artistry of dancing

[ripleymonroe 794]

Don't get me wrong I (lizard brain) love the contact of the CR, but miss the class of the stage performance.

 

Haha, I learned this one the hard way. I am also used to the classic ways of clubs (I'm not originally from Ottawa). Back home, when I first explored the clubs, contact wasn't allowed in the CR (they could touch you but you couldn't touch them). But, it was also very normal to place a 5$ bill in a dancer's bra or underwear while she was dancing on stage. Almost all dancers would typically walk off stage with a few tips and the ones who gave a great performance walked away with a LOT of tips.

 

So, here I am at a club in Ottawa and I take out a 5$ bill for one of my favourite dancers, expecting simply to slip it in her g-string.. but she tells me that I have to lay down on stage! I wasn't expecting that at all because I'd never seen it. And now, I have seen it at a few clubs here... nobody simply tips them stage-side anymore. I think that's too bad... having a customer go on stage cuts down on the performance, I find.

[scribbles 6031]

The US still has one dollar bills. That's a significant difference. One song would often earn a dancer $30 or more. I don't think dudes want to walk around with a pocket full of loonies here.

[Megan'sTouch 23875]

Well, I must not be the average SC patron then, because for me, a good stage show is key. I've often wondered why more dancers don't make any effort, and I guess this is the answer.

 

But, to me, I will often try to wait for a dancer's stage show before getting a private dance. In particular, the following items will make me much more interested in a particular dancer:

 

1. Make an effort. You don't have to win miss pole-dance America, but something other than walking around the pole and crawling on all fours shows us that you are at least trying.
   
2. Don't be afraid to smile! I feel like so many are trying so hard to look sexy that they never look like they want to be up there. Instead they've got the perma-pout (or simply look bored).
   
3. Eye contact is sexy, staring at the ceiling the whole time is not.
   
4. Change into a different outfit for the second dance. You have to change anyway, why not into a different look?
   

Combine all that -- someone who is making an effort, who catches your eye and flashes you a smile -- will be at the top of my list for a private dance, versus someone who walks around the stage all bored like, then spends the rest of the time hustling for dances. And I do feel there is a correlation with the quality of the private dances as well -- if the dancer doesn't make an effort on stage, why should I think a private dance would be any different?

 

I admit, I'm most likely an outlier though, as someone who actually pays attention to the dances on stage, doesn't have more than a drink or two, and doesn't immediately say yes to the first girl to ask for a dance. On the other hand, the stage dance is required of all dancers, so why not make an effort?

Good eye contact, appearing like you're having fun, etc. is good for business whether you are onstage or not. What you are describing to me is not artistry or theatrics, it's just a basic stage show.

[ripleymonroe 794]

Good eye contact' date=' appearing like you're having fun, etc. is good for business whether you are onstage or not. What you are describing to me is not artistry or theatrics, it's just a basic stage show.[/quote']

 

But I think the reason why it's being mentioned is because a lot of the stage shows are missing those basic qualities. I've seen this over and over again, maybe not so much on really busy nights but the last time I went out to one of the classier clubs, it was so bad that for the first time ever, I didn't even get a lap dance. I spent two hours watching women staring at the ceiling during their stage dances. :(

[1963Kennedy 10698]

Maude-most captivating show I've ever seen. Worked various clubs.

 

Carolyn-mature lady who worked at Pigales; could do a 360 off the pole and land on her pumps. Never seen that since-probably never will.

 

Max-NuDen-often would discretely give her $10 after her stage show. Appreciated her dance.

[turing 150]

But I think the reason why it's being mentioned is because a lot of the stage shows are missing those basic qualities. I've seen this over and over again, maybe not so much on really busy nights but the last time I went out to one of the classier clubs, it was so bad that for the first time ever, I didn't even get a lap dance. I spent two hours watching women staring at the ceiling during their stage dances. :(

 

Yes, exactly. The original question was if "real artistry" would be worth it in the club. The consensus opinion seems to be that while appreciated and admired, it is likely not necessary, or perhaps even worthwhile for the dancers. However, I think there is a lot of room for simply improving the "basic stage show", as Megan puts it.

 

You also have an interesting point about how busy the club is. It is perhaps understandable, but the less full the club is, the worse the performances on stage seem to get, and vice versa. Yet, it's less likely I'll get excited about a private dance if the dancers are just going through the motions walking around on stage. So, when it would be most useful to put on a good show (since there are fewer customers around), they are most likely to not put in the effort.

 

And, the flip side of that, is when the club is busy (say Pigale's on a Friday night), a dancer can wow the crowd with a stage show, and then be impossible to find for a private dance afterwards.

[turing 150]

However, I'm not sure that a woman's dance on stage is a good indication of her performance in private. I very rarely ask a woman to dance for me without seeing her stage show, but in the instances where I have been completely intrigued by a dancer just from talking with her, she was amazing in the CR (but later, when I finally got to see her on stage, the show was not impressive at all).

 

You're most likely right -- it's most likely a rationalization I've created so I can avoid spending so much money in the CR... :)

 

And you're right... long eye contact and a smile from someone on-stage can be an intense experience. It always starts with eye contact. :)

 

The best CR experiences I've had, have always been with someone I'm really attracted to (obviously), but also someone that I've had a bit of a connection with. That can start from the performance on stage, with a simple smile and a look.

 

Going completely off topic, but it can also happen from an approach that is different from the bog standard "where are you from", "how's your night going" openers that most dancers use... For example, Cherry @ Barb's got me with that aforementioned smile on stage, then a funny compliment when she approached. It's amusing, but I think a lot of dancers could benefit from studying some of the "pickup-up artist" material out there, since a strip club is in many ways the typical meet market atmosphere, but with the gender roles reversed.

[toine 30556]

 

You also have an interesting point about how busy the club is. It is perhaps understandable, but the less full the club is, the worse the performances on stage seem to get, and vice versa. Yet, it's less likely I'll get excited about a private dance if the dancers are just going through the motions walking around on stage. So, when it would be most useful to put on a good show (since there are fewer customers around), they are most likely to not put in the effort.

 

And, the flip side of that, is when the club is busy (say Pigale's on a Friday night), a dancer can wow the crowd with a stage show, and then be impossible to find for a private dance afterwards.

 

Dancing is giving a performance, and as any performer, dancers may need to draw energy from the crowd. When there are only a handful of guys sitting on their hands, it may be difficult to be enthusiastic and find within oneself to give a really good show.

I recall more than 15 years ago, I was in a club in Vancouver and in attendance there were a group of guys from Cuba (a soccer team, or something). They REALLY enjoyed the performance and were very demonstrative. The ladies provided in turn very good shows, likely as they saw very clearly their work was appreciated. It was not even the case they were being tipped for their extra effort. They probably just felt appreciated, which we all need at work!

[whiteman 14028]

I was married to a woman who became a dancer when I was living in the US, and it was very different there.

 

For one thing, contact was forbidden. My lizard brain doesn't like that, but the more evolved parts of me know that it's also a reason why the stage show was so much more successful. There, dancers I was friends with would easily make several hundred dollars a night off of stage tips. There were a few who were simply outstanding. I remember one who called herself Sin; very goth with the tatts and piercings, and danced to Marilyn Manson. But, man was she acrobatic and athletic. She was simply amazing to watch, as well as stunning.

That's true, over the years the US has become an oppressive society, with many rules and regulations on personal conduct that you wouldn't get here. Religious strife has turned them into a Jerusalem (for all we know, the real Jerusalem might be more liberal than them). Some places, strip clubs have been shut down and the only form of entertainment they have is Hooters. I think for that reason we're a little more spoiled here, since we get more action in the CR.

[Vixen31 100]

If a girl is intoxicated/stone and appears to be in lala land, or bored on stage with 2 dancing moves it is turn off (my own opinion). I prefer a girl that is feisty and certainly knows how to dance on stage with great athletic skills.

[ripleymonroe 794]

If a girl is intoxicated/stone and appears to be in lala land, or bored on stage with 2 dancing moves it is turn off (my own opinion). I prefer a girl that is feisty and certainly knows how to dance on stage with great athletic skills.

 

When it comes to women who are too drunk or high, I would like to see the manager on staff get involved to prevent her from dancing or to send her home. I have seen women fall off stage, fall off chairs and fall off tables. I don't even care about how it's not good for business - it's just not safe for her and for the other dancers or clients.

 

In regards to the other poster who mentioned that it's hard to get motivated when there are only a few guys in the bar, I totally understand that. Some women can get by because they're awesome at working the floor. But then, why have the stage shows? At one point, one thing feeds the other - maybe if the shows were better during the day, they'd bring in more clients?

[Dreamgirl 246]

a dancer can wow the crowd with a stage show, and then be impossible to find for a private dance afterwards.

 

couldnt have said better!!

[curious2 323]

Max-NuDen-often would discretely give her $10 after her stage show. Appreciated her dance.

 

 

Max has one of the most interesting shows I've ever seen. She's extremely energetic and she dances to "world" music that has probably never been heard in any strip club before. She's very sensuous in the CR too, and busy--the last time I was there she came over to me right away and said sorry she couldn't dance for me that night as a regular had reserved her for 3 hours!

[ripleymonroe 794]

Max has one of the most interesting shows I've ever seen. She's extremely energetic and she dances to "world" music that has probably never been heard in any strip club before. She's very sensuous in the CR too, and busy--the last time I was there she came over to me right away and said sorry she couldn't dance for me that night as a regular had reserved her for 3 hours!

 

Hmmm, I haven't been to that club yet. Do you happen to know on what nights she works?

 

On a side note, you can 'reserve' dancers?! I thought you had to pay per songs... how do you reserve a dancer for an amount of time.. is that just something a dancer and client negotiate?

[Guest Bri*****e Da****]

I thought you had to pay per songs... how do you reserve a dancer for an amount of time.. is that just something a dancer and client negotiate?

 

Pretty much, yes. Some clubs like Pigale and Barefax (though not so much anymore) have the option of timed visits (half hour or hour intervals) with your dancer rather than by dance. But in clubs where that isn't the case, it's up to the dancer and her client to figure out what works for them.

[whiteman 14028]

Pretty much, yes. Some clubs like Pigale and Barefax (though not so much anymore) have the option of timed visits (half hour or hour intervals) with your dancer rather than by dance. But in clubs where that isn't the case, it's up to the dancer and her client to figure out what works for them.

That's actually not a bad idea, if you're into seeing a specific girl most days, then why not just come to a timed arrangement? I never thought of doing that.

[Megan'sTouch 23875]

On a side note, you can 'reserve' dancers?! I thought you had to pay per songs... how do you reserve a dancer for an amount of time.. is that just something a dancer and client negotiate?

This was something I would arrange with a regular client. It would be X amount for X hours and it would include our time drinking at the bar and in the champagne room. It's much easier to choose a flat rate than to count songs if you intend to spend a long time with a lady.

[waterat 20911]

I agree with Megan. Not only is counting songs more difficult..... I apparently can't do it! But I can be forgiven this failing with such beautiful distraction!

 

J

[scribbles 6031]

A question on the math, though: is this to the advantage of either side? In other words, is it more financially feasible to spend a pre-booked hour with a lady than pay for an hour of dances (I'd assume that's in the realm of 20 dances in many clubs)? Is it to the lady's advantage to know it is a sure $x for the time? How does someone price something like that?

[Megan'sTouch 23875]

A question on the math, though: is this to the advantage of either side? In other words, is it more financially feasible to spend a pre-booked hour with a lady than pay for an hour of dances (I'd assume that's in the realm of 20 dances in many clubs)? Is it to the lady's advantage to know it is a sure $x for the time? How does someone price something like that?

Unlike escorting/massage where your time starts when you enter the door, dancers spend time with their clients on the floor, sometimes drinking, and getting to know each other. The goal is, of course, to get them into the champagne room and make money.

 

I had regulars who enjoyed taking me to the champagne room maybe 2-3 times for maybe 5-10 dances each time. In between champagne room session we would sit together on the floor and order drinks. Let's say, just to make this simple, he would take me twice for 10 dances, which is about 40 minutes and $200 each time. I would likely spend 15 minutes on the floor chatting with him before going to the champagne room ( we are at 95 minutes) then maybe 15 minutes to take a break and get drinks (we are at 110 minutes) and then maybe 10 minutes at the end to say goodbye. In total I spent 2 hours with him, and was paid $400. If this were a regular and his habits were the same, I would suggest he pay me $400 for spending 2 hours with him, regardless of whether that time be in the champagne room or on the floor.

 

The problem with this method is that he, of course, wants to chat on the floor for free, and I want to minimize floor time and get into the champagne room so I can make my money. This can create some tension. When I am paid by the hour, I don't need to worry about "hustling" him and getting him into that champagne. I can just relax and let nature take its course, and he appreciates this too!

 

It's also extremely annoying to "count" songs and when you are in the champagne room for 5-10+ songs, it's very easy to lose track. When I don't have to count songs, it's easier for me to just have fun and provide a good experience.

[scribbles 6031]

See, that's just what I was looking to understand better. I know in some clubs they don't cut songs, or don't cut them the same way. So, if we assume 1 hour is possibly 20 songs ($400), does the dancer risk that she offers an hour for $200 where the time actually spent in the CR might have earned her more? It's guaranteed in her pocket if it's paid up front, but possibly a "loss."

For a guy, I'd gladly pay the $200 an hour because I generally spend that for less time, overall, between talk and CR.

[Megan'sTouch 23875]

See, that's just what I was looking to understand better. I know in some clubs they don't cut songs, or don't cut them the same way. So, if we assume 1 hour is possibly 20 songs ($400), does the dancer risk that she offers an hour for $200 where the time actually spent in the CR might have earned her more? It's guaranteed in her pocket if it's paid up front, but possibly a "loss."

For a guy, I'd gladly pay the $200 an hour because I generally spend that for less time, overall, between talk and CR.

At the Nu Den, there were roughly 16 songs per hour at $320/hour. At Bare Fax, Pigales, and Barbarella's, there were roughly 17 songs per hour at $340/hour.

 

I don't see it as guaranteed money at the risk of potential loss, because I'm typically charging him the same amount of money for the same amount of time. The goal is not to give him more, and it's not to make myself more money. The goal is really just to have a fair transaction without counting songs and feeling the need to continuously upsell. It's more relaxed for both of us and this arrangement never made me more or less money.

[Mister T 45020]

As added precision on this thread, both Pigales and Barefax have Flat Fees posted for time-based .... time spent with a dancer. Both clubs offer the hour at 300$, for example.

 

I've used this (and half-hours) with dancers i know well and saw often, and it's time spent in the CR as we always agreed to count the time there. But, mind you, the arrangement came over time and getting to know one another better.

 

On a side note, you can 'reserve' dancers?! I thought you had to pay per songs... how do you reserve a dancer for an amount of time.. is that just something a dancer and client negotiate?

 

I think Bridgette and and Megan provided great answers and i agree from a point of view of being an SC patron. Arrangements can be made if the "house rules" are inexistent on this point. Pigales has private rooms as well at an extra fee, but you go through the manager as that fee is paid to the club. Plus, i was told you can ask for a particular dancer as well.

[Guest Bri*****e Da****]

The goal is really just to have a fair transaction without counting songs and feeling the need to continuously upsell. It's more relaxed for both of us and this arrangement never made me more or less money.

 

I don't have anything to add to this, I just felt it should be reiterated. Dancers aren't always trying to hustle as much as they can out of their clients for as little work as possible - many like providing an enjoyable experience in the club, and arrangements like this make that much smoother.

[curious2 323]

Hmmm, I haven't been to that club yet. Do you happen to know on what nights she works?

 

Unfortunately I don't get to go to the Nuden as often anymore as I used to, but she seems to be a night girl who gets there in the early evenings late in the week.