Do You Believe In Love?

[renegade 11027]

Lust, anger, passion, boredom, accomplishments, regrets,excitement, companion, room mate, soul mate, illness, lonelyness, contempt, adoration, best friend and sometimes enemy, monogamy and infidelity all part of my 36 years of marriage, i believe in love but realize it has many faces !

[nntsci 11076]

Its only if you want to get divorced quickly (in less than a year) that adultry is relevant, but it is my understanding the faulted divorces often end up taking longer (and cost more) due to the legal rangling that go on so if you want a fast quick cheap divorce, the 1 year separation works better. I was amazed when my in-laws got divorce how irrelevant the adultry (he was living with his girl friend) really meant to the proceedings. But the squabble over the division of assests dragged on for some time because of mutual hatred.

 

Additional Comments:

Seeing an Sp behind your partners back is a cop out if you hold it up as a substitute for a lack of intimacy in your relationship. It just means that you lazy and aren't communicating and doing the hard work at maintaining your marriage. If you're not having sex then it's a pretty clear indication you have been ignoring the things that are important, i.e. when the wife comes home worn out from a day at work, you take her out to supper or get her to sit down while you do supper.

 

Thats an amazingly judgemental considering the sight we are on. There are actually a lot of women that don't want to have sex. I don't know anything about the life situation of the person who you were responding too, but you leap to a lot of conclusions about what is wrong in his marriage. You can't always blame the man for all the failings of a relationship.

 

According to http://www.azcentral.com/health/news/articles/2010/09/14/20100914women-not-interested-in-sex-study.html

"While almost 40 percent of women have low libido, it only causes distress for 10 percent of them, according to the PRESIDE study."

 

In my own marriage, in the past year we've seen 6 plays together, an opera, and spent a week with her in Paris. I cook, I spend more time with our kids than she does, and frankly she could work part time without jeapardizing our finances or her carreer. The fact is that sex is not a priority to her.

 

Lately shes has traits similar to Sheldon from the Big Bang Theory. When she hears on a talk show that sex and intimacy are an important part of marriage, she reacts like Sheldon would to the news that say giving a birthday presents is a "non-optional social convention". She clicks into an altered state of being and wants sex. Its really quite funny, but short lived. If talk shows would address the issue sexual intimacy more often, I'd probably not need to seek out the services of SP... but there you have it. I've actually tried to bring up the issue myself, but she only responds if someone else mentions the topic (Ironically I have more impressive health care related credentials than the people they typically interview on these talk shows). Someday I should tape one of those talk shows.

[MightyPen 67414]

> Speaking of soul mates, I watched Crazy, Stupid, Love last night. I really enjoyed the film... except for the last 10 minutes where it becomes sappy and sentimental. I especially loved the scenes with the school teacher (Marisa Tomei). Hilarious film, except for the sappy bit at the end about soul mates.

"500 Days of Summer" does a surprisingly grown-up version of the falling-in-love/soul-mate thing with two flawed characters going through the whole ride (with one substantially more into it than the other).

 

It's a much more real-world message than I've seen before.

 

Worth the watch, I thought, with neither an overly optimistic nor overly pessimistic view... just matter-of-fact.

[nntsci 11076]

"500 Days of Summer" does a surprisingly grown-up version of the falling-in-love/soul-mate thing with two flawed characters going through the whole ride (with one substantially more into it than the other).

 

Thanks, I'll check it out. I think Zooey is hot; love her hair.

[PatrickGC 10792]

Call me sentimental but I do believe in love. I just have to look at my parents who have been married close to 40 years and can see they still love and care for each other deeply.

 

It goes without saying that the very definition of marriage has changed dramatically over the years. One might say, that there is no longer a universally adopted definition, to say nothing of the expectations.

 

Even though I am single I know true love exists and one of its defining characteristics is that it takes time and gets deeper with age. For the modern world that poses a great problem because we have compartmentalized our lives into snack size bytes. People are in a rush and they mistake the infatuation phase as love.

 

Close connections with elders or grandparents also helps define love. It is then that a person understands that love is an ongoing experience. Again, many people have lost that historical perspective.

 

Love is elusive, complicated, often not what one expects, and yet, with absolute certainty there. [i'm thinking of someone at this moment, and they know it to, who I have loved for 30 years and more.]

 

PatrickGC

(A true Cerb romantic.)

[piano8950 32577]

I'm young, and naive, and I believe in love. Just not the Hollywood notion of it.

 

I think there are tons of factors today that make for an unsuccessful marriage. Cohabitation prior to marriage in my humble opinion is one of them. Of all my friends, and everyone else I know who've opted for this, the top two reasons I hear are "Save money" and "test the waters". Moving in with someone is massive, and doing so for financial reasons, or just because it's convinient seems like they're just rushing along before their heart's really in it. And the whole test the waters notion is completely foreign to me. I can't imagine anyone (with the exception of extreme cases) finding out that the love of their life is intolerable to live with. I believe that if you love someone, they will have some bad, oh so annoying habits. He may snore, she may leave tons of hair at the bottom of the shower drain, no big deal.

 

It's not to say that they aren't a few exceptions to this, I've seen some, but it's rare. I just feel that marriage should have some privileges, some amazing rights that I am not able to experience prior to it. Being able to wake up in the morning every day, or hold her in my arms every night, that's what I want when I'm married. And a lot more. A lot of my clients say the same thing after getting married - they feel the exact same, no big difference, and the honeymoon was awesome. There is no new phase, annoying habits will remain, except instead of working together committed to a life together and working it all out, they have come to tolerate them.

 

However, I'm only speaking of what I've seen oh so many times, not personal experience.

 

But I'll say it again, I believe in love. I see my parents, and their cute little habits, how my mom stays quiet when my dad goes on his droning about something insanely insignificant, or my dad listens, and does everything my mom says when she goes on a cleaning/gardening rampage. They don't say "I love you", they don't need to. They call each other in the middle of the day at work, constantly offer to do the dishes so the other can sit down and relax.

 

Not always grand or public gestures of love, just a constant, steady stream of seemingly insignificant moments - That's love to me.

[castle 38816]

Yeah I believe in love...I think the problem with high divorce rates is that our culture has become a very disposable one...in the sense that EVERYTHING is disposable. Whether it be a cell phone, a kitchen appliance or a relationship. Once upon a time, when something started showing signs of wear and tear, say, a VCR or something, we didn't automatically kick it to the curb and go out and buy a new one. We would open it up and tinker around with the insides and try to find the problem, often getting a shock, slicing our finger open, and cursing all the while, literally putting our blood, sweat and tears into it....but once it started working again, the feeling of reward and satisfaction was that much greater for the work we put into it. Or, worst case scenario, if we couldn't fix it ourselves we'd take it out and pay to have a professional repair it (read: tv repairman/marriage counselor). And only as a very last result would we even consider going out and buying a new one.

 

This is not the case anymore, I think we've gotten it into our mind that everything is so easily disposable and replaceable, and whether it be consciously or subconsciously, this somehow includes relationships too. I'm not being holier than thou, I'm guilty of this too. I've never been married but I think every relationship I've been in, has ended too easily without putting up much of a fight, neither one of us made the necessary efforts needed to keep things going. Once things started getting boring or stale, we abandoned ship.

 

The problems marriages/long term relationships encounter today are the exact same problems which were encountered 20, 30, 50, 100 years ago. The love felt today between two people is no less powerful than it was by two people in the past. The difference is now, in our culture today, no one is willing to put the necessary work into making something work. We just go on ebay and find a new one, often at what we perceive to be a better price. At least that's how I see it.

[nntsci 11076]

"The love felt today between two people is no less powerful than it was by two people in the past. The difference is now, in our culture today, no one is willing to put the necessary work into making something work. We just go on ebay and find a new one, often at what we perceive to be a better price. At least that's how I see it."

 

Part of the problem is that because there are more women in the work force, men and woman interact more with the opposite sex and that leads to a lot of things going on.

 

The thing is that people get divorced not only because they fall out of love, but because they fall in love with someone else. Now it used to be that the couple would go on living together like that; these days woman are less likely to ignore signs that their hubby has a mistress.

[nntsci 11076]

Not trying to be too much of a cynic today (though I do enjoy being a cynic, just not today), but one of the illusions of change in society is brought on by the greater longevity that people enjoy today. While it might seem that in the past people stayed together longer, if you take into account the much much much higher death rates and shorter life span, yeah its true til death do we part was a lot easier when the life expectancy was only 40 years.

 

Not only that, people in their 50s and 60s today are much healthier than they were 100 years ago and more apt to be able to screw around than in the past (thanks in part to viagra).

[etasman2000 15994]

Before I believe in something I would like to know what I am being ask to believe in......

 

Do you mean agape - unconditional love. Notice the recursive meaning....

 

Do you mean eros - sensual desire and longing.

 

Do you mean phillia - friendship

 

Do you mean stroge - affection between family members

 

It is possible to feel eros, philia, storge and perhaps even agape with more then one person, isn't it ?

 

Why then do we have the fixation on a monogamous relationship ?

 

Is it possible to feel a emotion forever, every living moment ?

 

Of course not! Imagine feeling fear every single second of your life. You will be mentally and physically exhausted and breakdown.

 

Why then the believe that love is forever without ebbs and flows ?

[nntsci 11076]

"500 Days of Summer" does a surprisingly grown-up version of the falling-in-love/soul-mate thing with two flawed characters going through the whole ride (with one substantially more into it than the other).

 

It's a much more real-world message than I've seen before.

 

Worth the watch, I thought, with neither an overly optimistic nor overly pessimistic view... just matter-of-fact.

 

 

I finally got around to renting/watching this... told my wife it was recommended by someone and fortunately she didn't ask who.

 

I loved it. Funny, but sad, and hopeful. I particularly liked how they didn't depict either of them as being wrong. She didn't love him, and never said she did. He was hurt, but he didn't go over board either and stalk her or try to hurt her either.

 

I love Zooey's hair.

[Guest s******ecan****]

Not to be cynical because I do believe in love, I came across the following the other day and thought I would share

 

"Relationships are like garage sales, from a distance they look interesting, but when you get close you realize its just a bunch of junk you don't need"

I do believe in love, both the fondness that comes from deep bonds, and also the Heathcliff and Cathy lose yourself kind.

[MightyPen 67414]

I finally got around to renting/watching this... told my wife it was recommended by someone and fortunately she didn't ask who.

Haha! Yeah, that answer could have been awkward.

 

Glad you liked it. I agree, it did a very grown-up job of showing two people who were flawed, but not malicious; and things didn't work out, but you could kind of see why. It was a relationship with the Hollywood magic taken away, and instead a frank look and the up-and-down cycle that any relationship can go through. And fundamentally... that a) you have to move on, and b) happiness and fulfillment come from within, and can't be contingent on one particular other person.

 

The guy's problem was of course that he had inflated the idea of the relationship to be something supernaturally awesome, and thought it had to follow "rules of love" and therefore last forever. Fact is, it doesn't work that way -- relationships reflect the people in them, and we're all only human.

 

Summer, Zooey's character, went into the relationship with a wiser, more worldly point of view, and conducted herself well throughout (navigating the downturn in the relationship as well, or badly, as anybody else typically does). Her one big black mark was the way she conducted herself afterward: the meeting on the train/fun and mixed signals at the reunion party/an invitation to a party at her place once they're back home/aaaaaannnnd oops, it's not the party he was expecting. Bad behaviour on her part, but still seems more unaware than malicious.

 

One of my favourite bits is when the three little things he so likes about her early on become the three little things he says he hates about her once things are turning sour (her charming little laugh... that stupid little laugh!). :) And of course... early on, at that point The Morning After, where he sees his reflection in the car window as Han Solo. Hee hee.

 

Anyway... as I said, glad you liked it too.

[nntsci 11076]

Thanks again. I loved the scene when he saw himself as Han Solo. The party was a great depiction of the difference between expectation and reality. I don't think she lead him on there, but she should have told him at least that she was seeing someone else. She had told him though that it was over and had asked him if he was willing to just be friends.

 

I just watched it again. When Summer invited Tom to her place for the party she invited him to a party on "our" rooftop... not "my rooftop". He never asked who the "our" was. She she did in fact tell him that there was somebody else, he just didn't notice.

[LeeRichards 177238]

Do I believe in love ? Absolutely !!!

 

Sometimes a loved one is taken from us or it just wasn't meant to be "forever" which of course is never expected or wanted to happen. But sadly it does. It is sad and disheartening. Over time we grieve and move on.

 

What I will say given my personal experience in life is don't go looking for love.....let it find you ! That is the most special kind of love that just happens when you least expect it and it is an amazing feeling :) Like it was meant to be.

[Katherine of Halifax 113932]

Do I believe in love ? Absolutely !!!

 

Sometimes a loved one is taken from us or it just wasn't meant to be "forever" which of course is never expected or wanted to happen. But sadly it does. It is sad and disheartening. Over time we grieve and move on.

 

What I will say given my personal experience in life is don't go looking for love.....let it find you ! That is the most special kind of love that just happens when you least expect it and it is an amazing feeling :) Like it was meant to be

 

.

There is never a way of predicting love, it can sneak up on you!

[Nicolette Vaughn 294340]

I've been doing some thinking about relationships. It seems that the idea of marriage or even being in a committed relationship doesn't carry the same weight as it did in my parent's generation. Of all my friends who have taken the leap of faith and gotten hitched, not one relationship has stood the test of time. It's either divorce city, or ending up trapped in a loveless marriage, sleeping in separate beds with SO's on the side. These days, marriage is akin to spending a few years with someone, grabbing all you can in the (eventual) divorce settlement, and then moving on, for better or worse. It's not if you get divorced, but when... sad state of affairs really.

 

I've never gone that route, and in some respects I consider myself lucky. I'd be content with the prospect of a long term relationship, but even those are difficult to attain. In my experience, they've started out with a flurry of unbridled lust and passion... not love per se, but more along the lines of infatuation and obsession. The women I've dated were only too quick to begin talk of moving in and having children, which in my estimation is incredibly ironic since the unions ended up being short lived. These trends, or themes seem endemic to today's societal culture which doesn't seem to be grounded in anything concrete.

 

This has caused me to shy away from the notion of romance and gravitate more toward the hobby, which I find refreshing in many respects - not least of which is the fact that it's very upfront and honest, which is more than I can say for many bonafide relationships. You always know where you stand here, as everything is based on full disclosure before the fact. At the very least, it eliminates any nasy surprises when you least expect them. That said, I still hold out hope for the future, but it begs the question, is perennial happiness achievable?

 

Don't give up... love will find you when you least expect it. That's what happened to me anyways and it is always worth the wait! lol. Everyone other relationship in the past wasn't necesssarily a waste of time ( okay, a few were esp when you are blindsided by someone) but they all were a lesson learned.

 

Take comfort in the fact that there are a lot of SPs here who have been good to you and like you said you know where you stand. I'm sure you will find it one day and I believe in fate and destiny so I'm sure someone good is going to find you. It may not be today or tomorrow but it's like Murphy's Law, if you stop thinking about it, the opposite will happen.

[FootFetishTess 1261]

I believe in lasting love.

Even after my first marriage was a bit of a nightmare and (thankfully) ended in divorce, I was still quite sure that True Love was out there. :-)

(It was! :-D)

 

That said, I also believe that we are all generally taught a model of romantic relationships that's... pretty messed up. A mixture of Courtly Love (where the focus is on longing rather than fulfillment) and Property Rights (see: history of marriage) that don't really go very well together. It leads to some very bizarre expectations - like all those romantic comedies wherein the protagonists hate each other on sight, but wind up In Love by the end of the movie; or the belief (thanks, Jane Austin) that someone who broods and has lousy communication skills is clearly a smouldering romantic who just needs the Right Person to bring them out of their shell...

Hoy.

It took me a long time to understand that "relationships are hard work" really meant "you must do the routine maintenance, even when you're tired or distracted; you must be willing to be vulnerable with each other, even when you're scared"... For so long, I'd thought what it meant was "relationships are an exercise in frustration once the hormones quiet down".

 

... But now that I understand that, and implement it, and have a sweetheart who is just as dedicated to those necessities as I am... Love is working out just fine. :-D

[Guest C**Tra****er]

Without a doubt I believe in love. I've been happily married for about 13 years and I have no regrets. You have to remember that love and marriage requires work on a daily basis in order to make it work. I suppose that's a very simplistic approach to both and there are always exceptions, but that's my take on it.

 

So yes, I believe in love, I am in love and I don't see that changing. Of course, I also believe that it's possible to love and be in love with more than one person at a time! Perhaps we can't always get everything that we want from one person!

[Midnite-Energies 110563]

I most assuredly believe in love and love in many different forms, variations, intensities and ways. I also believe love is a choice just as relationships are a choice because they take work.

 

I believe people have to start being more honest with themselves and others as well as addressing personal issues like beliefs, learned behavior, ego etc. There are many people who don't know what they want in a relationship or they do but won't admit it or accept it. They settle for someone because they feel they should or it's time or they're scared to be alone.

 

You can have feelings for someone or even love someone and not belong with that person. Sexual incompatibility will always lead to stress and frustration yet people are in these relationships every day. Different goals, ideas, needs and wants all impact. Relationships are work, even the good ones. You have to chose to work through problems instead of throwing in the towel, chose to change or step outside comfort zones. You must also realize when it's time to walk away.

 

I believe if you want something bad enough, you WILL make it happen, good or bad. If you're honest with yourself about what you want, you're willing to take a risk, you have a clear focus, it will happen.

 

I also believe in can happen more than once...at a time. Love is a wonderful uplifting thing that makes us feel wonderful. It's when the ego gets involved with its jealousy and control and ownership that things get fuzzy.

 

I too believe that the SP/client relationship is intrinsically honest. Each partner knows what they are getting, there is communication and boundaries and these are discussed. I also believe within these boundaries real love can and does exist. Love doesn't care that it's a business transaction it only knows how the people feel and what value these interactions add to life. If one or both partners have an SO that doesn't detract from the honesty of the SP/Client relationship. Honesty means what you say is true, it does NOT mean full disclosure. If I have a secret that has no bearing on you, if I don't tell you, that doesn't make me dishonest. If you ask me and I lie, then I am dishonest.

 

Love comes in many forms and if you're open to that, you can and will find it. If you're only looking for the "fireworks and lifetime" descriptors that seem to be societal norms, you are shutting yourself off from anything outside this which means some bliss may be passing you by.

 

This is such a big topic with so many ins and outs but it boils down to "listen to your heart, follow your intuition and be open". Screw what everyone else says or does, this is YOUR life and you have to do what's right for you, including love.

[Guest ChantalSummers]

Beautiful words, Lee Richards. Love makes my world go around personally. In loving relationships comes the importance of honesty, forgiveness, trust, romance, connection, responsibility, being open minded, compromising, and commitment. Those have all been high priorities of mine in longtermm relationships. No nobody is perfect but being honest and forgiving goes a long way. When I'm single I don't attempt to look for relationships. Love arrives when you least expect it. In the meantime I value and appreciate the love I have for my family, friends, and passions in life.

[Surf_Nazis_Must_Die 8958]

I believe that I love beer!

 

But seriously,

 

I do believe I have either felt what would be called love or something that is as close as i'll ever get to. Not going to go into detail, but let's just say I had to take that feeling, lock it in a chest and kick it down into the deepest part of my soul's basement.

 

So as far as the classic love between a man and woman, for me, I'm not sure. For others, definitely. I witnessed it with my parents, and I see it with my sister and her husband.

 

A love I definitely believe in is a love I have for my niece, a love I have for my relatives even when they are far away, and a love I have for my best friend (been like brothers for 20+ years). Oh and a love I have for beer of course, did I mention that yet? ;)

[roamingguy 300292]

Well on the eve of the Celebration of My Father's Life some ramblings

My dad's second wife for the past seven to eight months played home nurse not knowing for how long. Harder than you'd think. Draining fluid off his lungs, putting up with his mood swings, having to feed him, driving him to all appointments staying with him 24/7

and much more. They were less husband and wife than dependant and caregiver

When she said I do after the line for better or worse she did end up with the worse and stayed with him...not romantic but true

Now dad, when he and mom were having problems in their marriage he didn't put any effort into trying to work out the problems...no counselling no nothing. He just left her

I just find it kinda ironic that the true love shown him when he was dying he couldn't muster even a little to mom and try to work out their problems together

Not a bash of dad BTW just a perspective of someone human

A rambling

RG

[toklat77 4616]

Every time I meet one of the ladies on CERB I am in love!

[nntsci 11076]

Every time I meet one of the ladies on CERB I am in love!

yes I two am a serial monogamist... lol.

 

My best friend got married in 1999, he told me he had never cheated on her because she was his best friend. That was a little more than a year ago. Then last summer his wife told him she didn't love him and a little later asked for a divorce. Ok, so he moved and suffered for a while in agony over his shattered marriage.

After a few month of loneliness he got himself onto a dating service.

A couple months ago he met someone and started dating and is now having the best sex of his life.

A couple weeks ago he was meeting with his soon to be x-wife, probably to pick up the kids, and mentioned that he's dating.

Now his (soon to be) x-wife wants him back; more precisely she wants to work on their relationship (something that she was not willing to do before).

 

So now he has to choose between the best sex of his life and his former best friend that told him she wanted a divorce?

 

Love is such a many splendored thing, LOL.