When a Treasured Gentleman...

[cat 262460]

...Crosses the line

 

Over the span of my career, on more occasions than I would like, I have had to have a conversation with a client who wants to "be friends". I think it's important to explain to hobbyists what this actually means to us; why it is crossing a line and why this conversation is one we should never have to have with a client.

 

There comes a point with a good working relationship where a client reaches a certain comfort level with his provider and for some reason it sometimes flips a switch within him. This is the phase of the relationship where there are genuine feelings shared and some clients misinterpret these emotions. He feels it's time to renegotiate the relationship and take it to the next level, to make it "real". Sometimes it's a romantic gesture and those clients are just very confused men and that is not the situation I want to discuss. The men I'm appealing to are the ones that feel that we should "be friends".

 

I would like to present this situation from the providers point of view. This is a conversation we providers unanimously dread. We very well may have genuine care and true fondness for this client; we may look forward to seeing him and enjoy his company immensely. Without a doubt these emotions change the quality of the experience for both parties in the best of ways but what it doesn't change is that THIS IS WHAT WE DO FOR A LIVING!

 

Asking us to be friends is an impossible ask and puts us in a difficult place. No matter how we answer, the dynamic is forever changed and not for the better. Many providers develop friendships with clients, myself included but it doesn't change the fact that our time is our livelyhood. It's how we provide for ourselves and our loved ones and asking us to alter the arrangement at hand will not end well for either party. If we accept, we have now lost a valued client that will need to be replaced to maintain our financial responsibilites. If we decline, we risk hurting this person that we care about and losing a valued client that will need to be replaced. Either way, the provider loses.

 

I admit that I see my work a little differently than most providers and I do consider my favorite guests to be friends as well as lovers. These men understand that I care deeply for them, they don't need free social time to see and feel that. They understand that if they choose not to contribute to my financial well being it will result in one of two outcomes.

 

1. I will have to spend the time I work with another client to ensure my financial obligations.

or

2. I will have to find alternative forms of income which means a 9-5 job to pay my bills.

 

Either way, the "friend" moves to the bottom of my responsibilities list. I first have to pay my bills, second is to take care of my loved ones and then third is my social life, which I don't actually have. This is our livelyhood and last time I checked, the bank doesn't take friendship for mortgage payments and according to Revenue Canada, it doesn't matter how many friends I have, there is no break on my taxes. If a client stops paying then he no longer provides for me or my basic needs. I have a couple of clients that moved from guest to friend but they were taken off the dance card. By honoring their "ask" for a friendship, they reliquished me as a lover and now I seldom get to see them as I just don't have time for socializing.

 

I accept my guests into my life with great care. I willingly allow my guests time with my body and my spirit in exchange for the financial security they provide me. It is delusional to think that if a guest withdraws the financial aspect of the relationship that I will have the time or the energy to continue a relationship with him. My guests don't pay me to be their friend, they pay me so that I have the freedom to spend time with them, NSA and at their convenience.

 

The demand is high for a "genuine GFE" experience but when we provide it we run the risk of guests misinterpreting it. Please understand that often when providers are a little aloof or cold, they may be simply trying to protect the business relationship as a lawyer or doctor would. For those of us who try to be more open and willing, don't put us in a situation where we end up losing you as a client because you "don't pay people to be your friend"...

 

cat

[roamingguy 300292]

To me, there are a couple of ladies I have met who are in the category of

friend. But that means "friends within the confines of this lifestyle" I certainly don't expect, nor would I ask for free time...I always understand at it's root, this is still the lady's livelihood. What man would try to have free time with a lady because he says they are friends, well that is shortchanging the lady, and is not friendship, not to mention disrespectful. Just as I have bills to pay, so does the lady, and a friend doesn't make it difficult for the lady to make an income.

By friends, at least for me, it means during your encounters, you are both comfortable enough to talk about subjects which under a normal SP/Client relationship would be considered off limits. You look forward to your encounters because you are seeing a friend again. And those encounters have a special intimacy to them.

Also, understanding the nature of this lifestyle, friendship doesn't equal possessiveness and exclusivity. And it doesn't mean Capital "F" feelings, the only four letter word beginning with "L" that applies here for me is "Like" I like the lady. It just means the times you are together are special. And those times I as a friend and gentleman, I still happily pay the donation in full (plus tip and gift ;-) )

A rambling which I hope comes out right

RG

[Phaedrus 209521]

Something that should probably be added from the other side of the fence... a SP who's good at what she does will be able to make you feel like you're her favorite person in the world, and that she'd like nothing better than to spend every waking moment with you. But when you feel like that... it just means you've met someone who's very good at what she does, and although she may genuinely like you and enjoy seeing you, that doesn't mean she wants to do so all the time.

 

Yes, SP/client relationships do - very occasionally - go beyond the strictly professional. That doesn't mean it's likely to happen to you, Gentle Reader, or that you should try to make it happen.

[drlove 37204]

I only know of one instance where a crossing of boundaries was implemented successfully. In this particular case, there was a connection between the SP and the client, and they did become friends in real life. However, the flipside to this turn of events was that she (the SP) stopped seeing the gentleman as a client. For what it's worth, I'd say it's better to appreciate the SP/Client relationship for what it is - a business relationship that may evolve into a business friendship, and leave it at that.

[fredsmith 5240]

Situations like this will happen, they will never stop happening. We're human and when such intimate encounters occur there isn't anything to stop it.

 

I'm sure it's frustrating to the ladies but I think it is one of the unavoidable situations of the profession.

 

That may sound harsh but I believe it is a reality.

[MightyPen 67414]

Weird that my last post was about a guy reacting badly to being denied a service and treating an SP poorly. This is the other side of the coin; when a client becomes attached and a line blurs. The line was there for a good reason. Now feelings will at least be badly bruised, and what had been a great relationship within its natural boundaries is ruined.

 

I once lost a treasured friendship with a fantastic woman, who was married but (it turned out) feeling neglected. She made overtures, I knew that acting on them would ruin an awesome friendship, and as I tried to save things they instead collapsed. I was stunned how quickly we lost something so valuable built over a long time.

 

It's not the same thing Cat describes, but it's another example of two people with necessary boundaries, and what you lose when one of you tries to cross them. Everyone gets hurt and you tragically waste an important part of your life.

 

Keep perspective, and value the good things you do have for as long as you can. They're rare enough as it is.

[Athos 108589]

I do understand why this happens, but I also am somewhat mystified by it.

 

Friendships always exist within specific contexts. I have friends at work ... people whose friendship I really value. I never see them outside of work. We don't socialize. I also have friends that I do socialize with ... some from work, some from other parts of my life.

 

There are a number of ladies I consider friends. Some I consider very special friends. Yet that remains firmly within the context of the SP-client relationship. I'm quite happy with that ... and feel no need to look for more. And I consider it very real. no boundaries crossed.

 

Porthos

[Guest S****r]

Thank you to each of you for your comments on this thread. So far, each of you is bang on in what you say. I have some clients whose company and personality I enjoy so very much, and it saddens me when they want to cross that line. As Cat said, if I allow that crossover, then I have to take on a new client to replace the income, and then I have even less time available for friendship time.

 

I love having a friendship within the confines of the SP/client-friend relationship, but it seems a big loss when one wants to cross over into the friend arena. All of us seem to ultimately lose when that happens.

[mrgreen760 37785]

Friendly..perhaps..friends..no. Like any other service I pay for whether it's my chiropractor,

dentist, lawyer or mechanic etc, we may be friendly but we're not friends.

 

Peace

MG

[Studio 110 by Sophia 150333]

Well said Cat! I have faced this many times too. And the sad thing is, once that question comes up, and you answer no, and explain it to him, they always get upset, feel down or used...then they stop coming:( So not only have you tried to explain to the best care, you end up still loosing them:( It is indeed fustrating as we do have heart! Thanks for this post:)

[Gentleman11 10508]

I have to say I agree with most on this thread. As a business owner who relies heavily on suppliers and clients, I can only enjoy them as "business associates" who I enjoy for the most part - some more than others. I think the same holds true in the SP - hobbyist world as well.

[Guest]

I completely agree with you Cat. The most fun and exciting part of the sp/client relationship is the no strings attached part. This allows both parties to come and go as they please. Having no expectations allows both parties the freedom of an uncomplicated relationship. Let's face it we already have enough complicated relationships in our lives at times. Do we really want to taint our safe/fun space with complications we both do not need?

 

I really enjoy connecting and having a bond with my clients. I want my clients to be fulfilled emotionally and physically. I look at it as my job. I do connect more with certain clients and I really do care for the clients I have established a bond/relationship with. However, you have made a truly strong argument that all escorts have responsibilities and they are the up most priority for us all.

 

Please, do not put us in this predicament. It is hurtful and unpleasant for both parties. Having unrealistic expectations for this kind of relationship only causes grief and unnecessary headaches. The only way of avoiding this kind of problem is enjoying the time you spend with the escort of your choice.

[fortunateone 156618]

As a client, he always has to remember how he found the sp in the first place. It was a business services advertisement, not a dating or friendships site.

 

When you get a bit comfortable and relaxed it might be easy to forget that, but you shouldn't. Would you know this person if you hadn't found her that way? No. Would she see you in the first place if she hadn't put up that advertisement? No. Does any of that change just because it happens to be a 5th, 15th or 50th visit? NO.

 

It doesn't mean she likes you less than anyone else she knows who isn't a client, it just means that that is the condition under which you met, and the conditions under which you continued to meet. You can't go and change the conditions by which you continue to see her, in other words.

 

 

I suspect also that from time to time, there are somewhat manipulative people who threaten to take away that relationship (paid dates) if they don't get what they demand (unpaid dates) but that is so unfair. If that is the reason for setting up the first appointment, to somehow down the road attempt to change it to unpaid, then please do not make the first appointment, and spare us all that awkward moment of bringing it up and having to deal with that lol

[roamingguy 300292]

I suspect also that from time to time, there are somewhat manipulative people who threaten to take away that relationship (paid dates) if they don't get what they demand (unpaid dates) but that is so unfair. If that is the reason for setting up the first appointment, to somehow down the road attempt to change it to unpaid, then please do not make the first appointment, and spare us all that awkward moment of bringing it up and having to deal with that lol

 

I'm sure there are very many manipulative people that would do that...but those aren't in any way shape or form friends. They have no respect for the lady, and frankly, under the circumstances you describe, could never have had any respect for the lady. Part of friendship is mutual respect, and that means, on the part of the gentleman, is respecting that the encounters are still paid companionship, because this is the lady's livelihood...trying to get unpaid dates with a lady is the same as depriving the lady of some of her income, income she needs to live on.

And while this lifestyle at it's root is a business, by the same token it is a business, well a lifestyle unlike any other. In what other business do you share time with a women intimately, as some ladies have phrased it, their body and soul. If a friendship develops within the confines of this lifestyle, and the boundaries of this lifestyle are still respected, then

I see no problems

Another rambling

RG

[cat 262460]

Once again Miss Samanath, I suspect we were separated at birth...

 

cat

[Frank7 3939]

Wasn't sure if i should answer, just trying to offer a different perspective.

 

Trying to change the initial situation is what we've always been taught of in relationship/dating.In normal life, many people's first lover was someone they meet at school. Initialy, you only saw them cause you were both there to learn. Or you start as friend with someone, then eventually you start dating. Others it's by asking a co-worker out, or a client/provider situation( asking the cute waitress for her number).

Rarely does two people meet with the express intention to date from the start, except on blind dates and dating sites. But those are mostly for people who have difficulty finding someone.

So if all those conditions changing are okay (and the norme) it's not a big surprise that some try with a MA/SP.

 

Personnaly i wouldn't do it. Not cause i don't get attached but because there's 99% of chance the answer being no, and that would ruin the relation. If i get to the point i want more, i'll just stop seeing the lady rather then put her in that awkward position.

[Cyndall_Kent 6880]

Thank you for writing this. I feel quite the same, garnering a level of connection with someone is great, and actually preferable.

[volvolater 657]

Great topic and some wonderful thoughts expressed! I agree completely and both Samantha and Cat have explained the perils and pitfalls of trying to move from an SP/client type relationship to a true friend type of relationship. Once the client wants to spend "free" time with their provider, the dynamics are changed irrevocably and forever.

 

It is a fine line and I can understand how some of us become so enamored of and comfortable with their "favourite" that the desire to be more becomes overwhelming. Those of us who seek a deeper connection when seeing someone do have options though, short of trying to become friends.

 

Do you want to see her more frequently?? No problem, just bring an envelope! Interested in learning more about her, open yourself up to her as well.

 

I also believe that the more respect and value you can offer and bring to each and every encounter then the opportunity for greater access and emotional bonding grows. Value will be defined differently for each relationship, sometimes it's by listening and offering counsel if asked, other times it's by taking care of a need or doing a favour. Often it's the little things, being in tune to her wishes, desires or needs and then following through. The more one can offer that is of true value, without any expectation of reward, then it just might lead to the very place that many of us want to reach anyway...............becoming that friend that your provider enjoys spending time with!!

 

And best of all, you still retain the intimacy, perhaps even a preferred status, because nothing is off the clock.

[andflemcol 3975]

Lets face it...."friends" is a subjective term. In other words, what constitutes a friend could have a different meaning for me than anyone else. To me, if a special bond has been struck between 2 people, I could argue that is a level of friendship. This may not mean that the other person considers that a friendship is present. I think what the issue is in this thread is: if a special bond is present, should there be any expectations? Should there be any negotiation?

 

For me, the answer is no. If a friendship has been established, any changes in the relationship should occur naturally. If there become expectations or any negotiation, the relationship may fail.

[Capital Hunter 18263]

I agree with everything said just to add that it can happen to both sides. Yes it is likely happening a lot more to providers and it is very unfortunate that they should be put in that awful position but it has happened to me too that in more than one occasion I was asked by (dancer) providers that I used to see frequently as private dancers if she can move in with me (likely more so with dancers than escorts) and it is very hard to have to say no without hurting another human being feeling not to mention the very tense environment that will be automatically created in the SC afterwards (everytime she saw me coming there she was leaving in one case or in a second case trying to avoid me....I stopped going to my favorite SC for a while.....). Less likely with escorts as they are seen much less frequent.

 

In case it happen to providers it is likely more as a result of (perceived or imagined) love by hobbyists who may have misinterpreted the GFE encounter (important to remember "E" stands for experience not reality) or loneliness on the part of hobbyist wanting a woman in his life (and most likely he hasn't been successful to attract one outside the hobby and suddenly receiving lots of affection and love from a woman first time in life not recognizing the distinction that it is a paid date) and in case it happens to hobbyist it is more for economic reasons or her insecurity wanting to have a man in her life to be taken care of, or maybe love too. Though both sides doing the best they can to have a joyful pleasant encounter of GFE nature but it is important to remember the "E" part of the encounter and not to misinterpret the experience and recognizing the paid nature of the date. That said I don't rule out completely the very slim possibility that real love may develop between the two after frequent meetings realizing that they are each others' match resulting in permanent relationship or even marriage (I also believe in the parting of the Nile lol :)).

[Nichole Jenisen 696]

Samantha is so right!

 

I was going to write a whole thing, but her comments basically cover it.

 

SPs are different than other workers. If a client gets friendly with their dentist and they start hanging out as friends with no $ exchanged, presumably the dentist is not going to be looking in the client-turned-friend's mouth.

 

But if being friends means the SP listening to your stories, hanging out with you, charming you, entertaining you... then you are just getting the service you should be paying for!

 

If I am at a restaurant and a waitress keeps asking me how I am, would I like more water, and refilling my coffee, I am not going to say "wow, I love how this feels, we should be friends!" and expect her to do this all the time.

[Old Dog 179138]

Christian Bale is not Batman.

Morgan Freeman is not God.

Angelina Jolie is not Lara Croft.

 

Jane Smith from Nepean is not really the sultry Alotta Fagina, although like Batman, God and Lara Croft, she is a carefully crafted role executed to the highest standards.

 

Men get to see the persona named Alotta Fagina because that is the entity with whom she is willing to share. Jane from Nepean remains cloistered.

 

While Alotta lounges on a chaise wearing satin, silk, and chiffon sipping champagne with impeccable makeup, Jane is at home sleeping on her couch wearing track pants and a t-shirt with paint stains.

 

While Alotta is a capricious bon vivant, Jane worries about her cable bill, her condo fees and her mortgage payment. She hopes her car will last at least two more years.

 

When the lines gets blurred, the role changes. Like many of you, Alotta wishes anonymity when she reverts to Jane. She may be a sister, an aunt, a daughter, a mother or perhaps a wife. She has taken risks not unlike our own; her private life is her refuge - a place not to be breached unless invitation is offered.

 

Enjoy the company of your provider. The intimacy you share is magical. Just remember that when you are finished, you BOTH get to return to your other lives.

[cat 262460]

Christian Bale is not Batman.

Morgan Freeman is not God.

Angelina Jolie is not Lara Croft.

 

Jane Smith from Nepean is not really the sultry Alotta Fagina, although like Batman, God and Lara Croft, she is a carefully crafted role executed to the highest standards.

 

Men get to see the persona named Alotta Fagina because that is the entity with whom she is willing to share. Jane from Nepean remains cloistered.

 

While Alotta lounges on a chaise wearing satin, silk, and chiffon sipping champagne with impeccable makeup, Jane is at home sleeping on her couch wearing track pants and a t-shirt with paint stains.

 

While Alotta is a capricious bon vivant, Jane worries about her cable bill, her condo fees and her mortgage payment. She hopes her car will last at least two more years.

 

When the lines gets blurred, the role changes. Like many of you, Alotta wishes anonymity when she reverts to Jane. She may be a sister, an aunt, a daughter, a mother or perhaps a wife. She has taken risks not unlike our own; her private life is her refuge - a place not to be breached unless invitation is offered.

 

Enjoy the company of your provider. The intimacy you share is magical. Just remember that when you are finished, you BOTH get to return to your other lives.

 

This is why you are so treasured...

cat

[Gabriella Laurence 301887]

...Crosses the line

 

Over the span of my career, on more occasions than I would like, I have had to have a conversation with a client who wants to "be friends". I think it's important to explain to hobbyists what this actually means to us; why it is crossing a line and why this conversation is one we should never have to have with a client.

 

There comes a point with a good working relationship where a client reaches a certain comfort level with his provider and for some reason it sometimes flips a switch within him. This is the phase of the relationship where there are genuine feelings shared and some clients misinterpret these emotions. He feels it's time to renegotiate the relationship and take it to the next level, to make it "real". Sometimes it's a romantic gesture and those clients are just very confused men and that is not the situation I want to discuss. The men I'm appealing to are the ones that feel that we should "be friends".

 

I would like to present this situation from the providers point of view. This is a conversation we providers unanimously dread. We very well may have genuine care and true fondness for this client; we may look forward to seeing him and enjoy his company immensely. Without a doubt these emotions change the quality of the experience for both parties in the best of ways but what it doesn't change is that THIS IS WHAT WE DO FOR A LIVING!

 

Asking us to be friends is an impossible ask and puts us in a difficult place. No matter how we answer, the dynamic is forever changed and not for the better. Many providers develop friendships with clients, myself included but it doesn't change the fact that our time is our livelyhood. It's how we provide for ourselves and our loved ones and asking us to alter the arrangement at hand will not end well for either party. If we accept, we have now lost a valued client that will need to be replaced to maintain our financial responsibilites. If we decline, we risk hurting this person that we care about and losing a valued client that will need to be replaced. Either way, the provider loses.

 

I admit that I see my work a little differently than most providers and I do consider my favorite guests to be friends as well as lovers. These men understand that I care deeply for them, they don't need free social time to see and feel that. They understand that if they choose not to contribute to my financial well being it will result in one of two outcomes.

 

1. I will have to spend the time I work with another client to ensure my financial obligations.

or

2. I will have to find alternative forms of income which means a 9-5 job to pay my bills.

 

Either way, the "friend" moves to the bottom of my responsibilities list. I first have to pay my bills, second is to take care of my loved ones and then third is my social life, which I don't actually have. This is our livelyhood and last time I checked, the bank doesn't take friendship for mortgage payments and according to Revenue Canada, it doesn't matter how many friends I have, there is no break on my taxes. If a client stops paying then he no longer provides for me or my basic needs. I have a couple of clients that moved from guest to friend but they were taken off the dance card. By honoring their "ask" for a friendship, they reliquished me as a lover and now I seldom get to see them as I just don't have time for socializing.

 

I accept my guests into my life with great care. I willingly allow my guests time with my body and my spirit in exchange for the financial security they provide me. It is delusional to think that if a guest withdraws the financial aspect of the relationship that I will have the time or the energy to continue a relationship with him. My guests don't pay me to be their friend, they pay me so that I have the freedom to spend time with them, NSA and at their convenience.

 

The demand is high for a "genuine GFE" experience but when we provide it we run the risk of guests misinterpreting it. Please understand that often when providers are a little aloof or cold, they may be simply trying to protect the business relationship as a lawyer or doctor would. For those of us who try to be more open and willing, don't put us in a situation where we end up losing you as a client because you "don't pay people to be your friend"...

 

cat

I know this is an old thread but because of what I am going through at the moment, I thought a gentle reminder couldn't hurt anyone, especially when I am already feeling hurt and sad.

 

Having to terminate an established relationship or a brand new exciting one because "love" feelings get in the way and the focus of the friendship is being temporarily put aside or willingly being ignored by the other party is never something a lady looks forward to.

 

Please, keep in mind that ladies who are involved in this industry are not using these special companionship experiences to gain new personal best friends or a significant other even if we care deeply about you.

 

Imposing your so called "love" feelings on (one of) the lady you are seeing and trying to change the dynamic of relationship is (almost) a guaranteed way to end what could've been a great long lasting experience or abruptly terminate the relationship you've already build together.

 

When you start feeling confused, sit back, think and give your head a good shake and a reality check before ruining that special something.

 

Gabby xox

[peacectryguy 12547]

Although this is an older thread, it definitely is something that has to be brought up from time to time. There are certain lines that should not be crossed in this industry. Actually, in any professional relationship, when you stop and think about it. I don't wish to be "friends" with my family physician and that little prostate exam is pretty damn "intimate". Okay, that rather silly joke aside, honestly, since when should we ever ask to be friends? Friendships grow and develop on their own if they are meant to be on both sides. I would say that I can be friends, to a certain extent with several people here, even though I have not met, nor likely ever will, meet in person. I would never ask for some "special friendship" consideration from even my most favorite SP, even though we could be considered friends, in a very real way. We really have to think with the big brain and make sure the little brain doesn't think, just goes with the flow.

 

Gabby, sorry to read that you are having some tough times. Wish you well and hope that this passes and makes you better and stronger. Be well and stay safe.