No liquor up front at the BareFax...

[curious2 323]

No poker in the rear, either...

 

 

One of my favourite dancers at the Nuden, Julia (young, brunette, long hair, small boobs, very firm smooth body--legit student who's extremely smart) told me that the BareFax lost their liquor licence for a little while. Looks like they'll get it back by Canada Day though...

 

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/BareFax+feels+cost+liquor+licence+loss/1719322/story.html

[spud271 47779]

They are going to have a rough couple of weeks without a liquor licence!

[canuckhooker 19203]

Well it was only for 5 days, and that is pretty much up by now. But one more example of big Brother cracking down and outlawing fun. The inspectors for the AGCO these days are being complete dickheads. I think we are headed back into prohibition.

[Peachka 4334]

Apparently, this was from an incident in January involving intoxicated patrons.

[Guest f***2f***]

Imagine that?? Intoxicated patrons in a bar...do you think that could happen??

[YoungStud 468]

Well, if (lol) you read the Citizen story, it appears there was a guy so drunk he was completely passed out on the table and it took a cop and a liquor inspector awhile to rouse him. I believe in the "Safe Server" program which requires you cut people off before they get so totally pissed they're potentially a danger to themselves or to others.

 

Bar owners know the rules. If you're greedy enough to over-serve somebody to the point they pass out with their face on a table for an hour, you're not doing anybody any favours. You don't get that pissed on a couple of beers. Apparently this guy had been drinking shots and pitchers for hours. Servers tend to be aware of how many they've served you once you go over having more than a few and have been there for most of the day, or whatever. Pretty flagrant violation. Whether it's a strip bar, corner bar or student pub, when you're being that stupid or greedy or both, as a bar owner, you're asking for trouble.

[thompo69 198]

Here's the ruling from AGCO:

http://www.canlii.org/en/on/onagc/doc/2009/2009canlii20242/2009canlii20242.html

 

And the decision on sanctions:

http://www.canlii.org/en/on/onagc/doc/2009/2009canlii29720/2009canlii29720.html

[canuckhooker 19203]

Thanks for posting that. Having read it, and seeing the individuals from AGCO involved I stand by my previous comments about these people being shit-heads and having absolutely no common sense. They themselves are drunk on power.

 

It sounds all very easy to cut people off when they appear drunk, but when you are serving "communal" portions like pitchers to a group, it is hard for the servers to stay on top of all the customers. There is also the problem of "pass through" where another patron gives the drunk patron a drink without the knowledge of the staff. (Here you go old buddy, here is the beer I owe you from last week.)

 

In this case, when the man was determined to be drunk, they cut him off. What they did wrong was not to evict him. I am not sure that the best thing to do is to throw these drunks out onto the street where others have to deal with them. Maybe letting them sober up, and calm down a bit is a better course of action, if they are causing no problems.

 

Of course the irony is, he could have had a bunch of booze before he arrived, or could have taken drugs, been tired etc. It is still the bars problem, even if they didn't over-serve him. If they throw him out, and he causes a problem, it is still the bar's problem, and they would be in as much trouble. That is in the liquor act and has been enforced. In fact they can also ding you if some drunk patron gets in your line outside the bar even though they got drunk somewhere else. You don't notice them and remove them before the liquor inspector does, you are in for a suspension even though you never served them a drop. Talk to the owner or manager of any popular bar and they will tell you all sorts of horror stories.

 

The Liquor laws in this province make very little sense, and are frequently contradictory. Most of the inspectors are on a power trip and really make it difficult to run a bar. In fact they are downright disrespectful to law-abiding, tax-paying citizens. The government is at war on "sin" whether that sin be our "hobby" or serving alcohol.

[thompo69 198]

Thanks for posting that. Having read it, and seeing the individuals from AGCO involved I stand by my previous comments about these people being shit-heads and having absolutely no common sense. They themselves are drunk on power.

 

It sounds all very easy to cut people off when they appear drunk, but when you are serving "communal" portions like pitchers to a group, it is hard for the servers to stay on top of all the customers. There is also the problem of "pass through" where another patron gives the drunk patron a drink without the knowledge of the staff. (Here you go old buddy, here is the beer I owe you from last week.)

 

In this case, when the man was determined to be drunk, they cut him off. What they did wrong was not to evict him. I am not sure that the best thing to do is to throw these drunks out onto the street where others have to deal with them. Maybe letting them sober up, and calm down a bit is a better course of action, if they are causing no problems.

 

Of course the irony is, he could have had a bunch of booze before he arrived, or could have taken drugs, been tired etc. It is still the bars problem, even if they didn't over-serve him. If they throw him out, and he causes a problem, it is still the bar's problem, and they would be in as much trouble. That is in the liquor act and has been enforced. In fact they can also ding you if some drunk patron gets in your line outside the bar even though they got drunk somewhere else. You don't notice them and remove them before the liquor inspector does, you are in for a suspension even though you never served them a drop. Talk to the owner or manager of any popular bar and they will tell you all sorts of horror stories.

 

The Liquor laws in this province make very little sense, and are frequently contradictory. Most of the inspectors are on a power trip and really make it difficult to run a bar. In fact they are downright disrespectful to law-abiding, tax-paying citizens. The government is at war on "sin" whether that sin be our "hobby" or serving alcohol.

 

I agree that the liquor inspectors can be assholes, but I disagree with you about this case. It sounds pretty cut and dry that they fucked up. Frankly, I think they're lucky they only got a five day suspension.

[YoungStud 468]

Bottom line for me;

 

Yeah, I'm sure a lot of liquor inspectors are anal-retentive rule-reciting control freaks who only became liquor inspectors because all the traffic ticket warden jobs were full (lol). But bar owners and staff have the obligation to monitor patron behaviour and deal with those who appear (passed out face down on a table for an hour would appear to qualify) to be intoxicated, whether through over-consumption on the premises, drinking eleswhere, or due to drugs or illness.

[thompo69 198]

Bottom line for me;

 

Yeah, I'm sure a lot of liquor inspectors are anal-retentive rule-reciting control freaks who only became liquor inspectors because all the traffic ticket warden jobs were full (lol). But bar owners and staff have the obligation to monitor patron behaviour and deal with those who appear (passed out face down on a table for an hour would appear to qualify) to be intoxicated, whether through over-consumption on the premises, drinking eleswhere, or due to drugs or illness.

 

Bingo, on all points.

[castle 38816]

Anyone know if they're back to normal yet?

[PistolPete 61421]

Kinda glad that I don't go to strip bars, after reading this thread, and then reading the citizen today regarding the shooting death of a young man of 19 years of age in Alymer after some lads left the Pink Cabaret...WTF is wrong with people today? Guess if you say the wrong thing you get snuffed out after trying to have a good time in a strip bar...Thanks but no fucking thanks, think I stick to seeing my lady friends (sp's).

[Cowboy kenny 50799]

From years of working in bars and strip clubs when I was a younger cowboy I can tell you that liquor inspectors can be total dicks. However in this case the Fax fucked up. The fact that their main defense was that the manager on duty was trained in Quebec is a weak defense, he's now working in Ontario he has to follow the rules for Ontario.

 

I worked the bars long before "smart serve" our policy then was to ensure the customer left the establishment safely, which usually meant calling or hailing a cab and making sure they did not drive their vehicle, no matter what they had to leave the premises, especially if they were nodding off. We did not subscribe to the "have a coffee" theory, then all we'd have is a wired, wide a wake drunk on our hands which is much worse.

 

I agree with the other poster they are lucky to have only received a 5 day suspension at a time of their choosing.

 

Phil's comment about the girls needing a drink to perform was totally out of line and only goes to personify stereotypes of that industry. Having worked with Phil in the past I can say that he's known for speaking before thinking. Some things never change.

[castle 38816]

Kinda glad that I don't go to strip bars, after reading this thread, and then reading the citizen today regarding the shooting death of a young man of 19 years of age in Alymer after some lads left the Pink Cabaret...WTF is wrong with people today? Guess if you say the wrong thing you get snuffed out after trying to have a good time in a strip bar...Thanks but no fucking thanks, think I stick to seeing my lady friends (sp's).

 

 

The article said it was gang related so I doubt it was just a case of saying the wrong thing to the wrong person. But I hear what you're saying, that's some scary shit, I remember hearing about something similar happening at Barefax about 10 years ago. That's why I only do the stripclub thing during the day. Things are just more likely to get out of control at clubs late at night rather than earlier in the day.

It's still no guarantee that something like this won't happen, but really, there's no guarantee that I won't be shot walking out my front door to go to work either.

[PistolPete 61421]

I know of a bar that their licence was revoked for a month....what for you ask.....well they were taking left draught out of glasses not finished and pouring back in the kegs for re-selling...don't worry I have seen it...that's why I never drink draught-bottle only thanks...

 

and ensure I drink at home so I can stumble into my own bed...not in a jail cell.

 

 

Licences are there to protect society from getting hurt by drinking too much...at your favourite watering hole, but so many want to do the wrong thing ..and drink and drive...so now the onus is on establishments to conform to policy...they try..then we as a society let them down by leaving drunk and getting behind a wheel.

 

 

My point is, simply- you see it happen take the freaking keys from him/her...no different if someone was hammered in my house..they are not leaving...only if they are in cab. I've lost 3 close friends growing up, because their failure to comply, cost them their lives, how much more common sense does it take. I could care a less about inspectors....I rather see the bars managed properly.

[PistolPete 61421]

Maybe I'm just an older generation individual, when we had a dispute at our age of 19 or older it was taken outside with the knuckles, my point is that if gangs are hanging out in strip bars, I don't need to visit them.

 

The article said it was gang related so I doubt it was just a case of saying the wrong thing to the wrong person. But I hear what you're saying, that's some scary shit, I remember hearing about something similar happening at Barefax about 10 years ago. That's why I only do the stripclub thing during the day. Things are just more likely to get out of control at clubs late at night rather than earlier in the day.

It's still no guarantee that something like this won't happen, but really, there's no guarantee that I won't be shot walking out my front door to go to work either.

[jay1972 186]

I know of a bar that their licence was revoked for a month....what for you ask.....well they were taking left draught out of glasses not finished and pouring back in the kegs for re-selling...don't worry I have seen it...that's why I never drink draught-bottle only thanks...

 

Sounds like the old Stoney Mondays, that place was horrid for doing that.

[mod 135640]

I know of a bar that their licence was revoked for a month....what for you ask.....well they were taking left draught out of glasses not finished and pouring back in the kegs for re-selling...don't worry I have seen it...that's why I never drink draught-bottle only thanks...

 

 

Pete, I watched the owner of a bar (who was bartending at the time) take the spill over from the draft (that grate under the draft tap) and pour it into a bottle and hand it to the waitress to take to a guys table. My friend was dating her and when I told him about it he said she did it all the time, often she would put the bottles back in the fridge and place a cap back on the bottle (so that the beer would get cold again and be less noticable). Not only is the beer in the overflow GROSS the bottle was some other guys unwashed bottle.

 

So the bottles are not even safe in some bars!

 

This was a small town hole in the wall place so I am sure it does not happen a lot but I can tell you first hand that it does happen.

[YoungStud 468]

That's pretty gross! So unless you're the kind of client who pays an escort to pee in his mouth as part of the turn-on, perhaps one should avoid beer of any kind in strip bars. Perhaps a glass of the house white . . . or perhaps not. Lol. Just shots right from the bottle for me boys.

[PistolPete 61421]

Does not surprise me, that is gross as well, some good bars, twist the cap/or use opener in front you..as YS said above perhaps a bottle of wine with cork unscrewed in front of you, if you are at a table.

 

I like to "belly up to the bar" (if I go out) and see what is happening, behind it...and well..when you turn around look enjoy the scenery.

 

A bar I did enjoy until they close it down was of course "Hooters":boobies:

 

Pete, I watched the owner of a bar (who was bartending at the time) take the spill over from the draft (that grate under the draft tap) and pour it into a bottle and hand it to the waitress to take to a guys table. My friend was dating her and when I told him about it he said she did it all the time, often she would put the bottles back in the fridge and place a cap back on the bottle (so that the beer would get cold again and be less noticable). Not only is the beer in the overflow GROSS the bottle was some other guys unwashed bottle.

 

So the bottles are not even safe in some bars!

 

This was a small town hole in the wall place so I am sure it does not happen a lot but I can tell you first hand that it does happen.

[bylogger 136]

Back in the 70's there was at least one inspector that would suggest a "tip" to help along the liquor license application. That said, after him, all of the inspectors I have met have been reasonable, respectful, and professional.

 

As to responsibility by the house for the patron, it is predicated on "professional knowledge" of the server and serving establishment, and the fact that service is based on profit. Consider it a counter-weight on a balance.

 

I also like to think that drunk patrons can sometimes be more dangerous than sober, for the staff, and other patrons.

 

But as in any regulation, there is room for interpretation. Another case of YMMV

 

(I came across this thread because I was looking for Ottawa strip club reviews)