A rant about students

[Peachka 4334]

Angela,

 

It is the bi-product of text messaging. They use acronyms in the TM's which are eventually incorporated into the way they write.

[VedaSloan 119179]

Angela,

 

It is the bi-product of text messaging. They use acronyms in the TM's which are eventually incorporated into the way they write.

 

I think it also has to do with the poor state of elementary education, when they're supposed to learn the basics of spelling and grammar, as well as the whole "no student left behind" campaign. I was lucky enough to go to private school, but my sister, who went to public school, received a decidely less-than-amazing education. When I was still at Laurier, I took a linguistics course for fun and we spent three weeks learning parts of speech and there were people in the class who thought we were going to fast because they weren't sure what a preposition was.

[Kathryn Bardot 99339]

I went to a public high school, and the education was satisfactory. The administration, on the other hand..

However, there's no excuse for having to sit through an entire class [first year English course at University] dedicated to the use of the semicolon. The only good part of this course was being able to skip most classes, show up for the rest just to hand in assignments, and still walk away with an A.

[misterme 110]

Not all university kids are over 17.

 

cordsboy, I'm kidding about the piece of paper, lol....that obviously doesnt exist, but its like saying going through the motions of a right of passage doesnt make you a pro...yanno?

 

and I see what you're saying Wrinkled but I think we're talking about university kids. who are over the age of 17

 

anyway all I'm sayin is lots of people seem to be brushing off the vent coz its just accepted that young ppl are allowed to be ignorant etc, its just accepted......and i find it too bad :-(

[YoungStud 468]

Babylon was a city-state in Mesopotamia. (This sentence does not require a semicolon.)

 

I received grades ranging from C- to A+ in high school and university; the marks were a reflection of both the skill levels of my teachers and my personal intellectual engagement with the subject matter. (This sentence benefits from a semicolon.)

 

YMMV. Lol.

[VedaSloan 119179]

Babylon was a city-state in Mesopotamia. (This sentence does not require a semicolon.)

 

I received grades ranging from C- to A+ in high school and university; the marks were a reflection of both the skill levels of my teachers and my personal intellectual engagement with the subject matter. (This sentence benefits from a semicolon.)

 

YMMV. Lol.

 

Ah, I bow down to you (though I believe someone else corrected me earlier). Despite Babylon being a city-state of Mesopotamia, it is still not a good idea to confuse the two. Athens was a city-state of Greece, but you wouldn't refer to Athens as Greece. There is no concept of "Mesopotamian", just as there is no concept of "Greek." You are Athenian or Spartan or Corinthian etc. Just as you are Babylonian, or a Sumerian, but not Mesopotamian. Mesopotamia simply refers to a region in the Middle East, which included Sumerian, Akkadian, Babylonian and Assyrian empires.

[APower20 400]

I weep for my generation. I'm just glad that I'm nearly finished University...

[Telywho 100]

Holy Toledo! Despite being quite busy this afternoon, I logged in to cerb to see if I could use the advice I often find on its pages to help me plan my evening. You know what I mean. To my great surprise I found this thread, and it has kept me busy reading for a good while.

 

It is a GREAT thread of conversation! The best I have found on any of the boards (such as aerb, berb, cerb, derb, eerb, ferb, etc.) My hat is off to Erin, Anessa, and all the other members who have contributed to such a fascinating topic of conversation.

 

Now..... I think I forgot what it was I was looking to do with my evening, so I am off to the library instead, to read more about Mess-o-topia. Silly me, I thought "Mess-o-topia" was the incredibly disorderly state in which my daughter loves to leave her room.

 

OK, back to work. I hope to meet Erin or Anessa at the library tonight.

 

** Despite the sarcastic fun I am having writing this post, I really mean it when I say that I really liked the thread, the opinions on it were totally unexpected and fascinating. Thanks to all for the breadth of views.

[conquistador 18487]

as well as the whole "no student left behind" campaign.

 

...isn't that a US campaign. Anyways, they are having the same problems that we are. I know that i could improve on my grammar and i have a University degree :grin:

 

I say forget about those annoying students and worry about your own education because at the end of the day they will probably be weeded out by the system....hopefully.

 

cheers.

[YoungStud 468]

I really mean it when I say that I really liked the thread, the opinions on it were totally unexpected and fascinating. Thanks to all for the breadth of views.

 

Welcome, T.W. You sound like the kind of participant who will indeed be welcome here.

[VedaSloan 119179]

Holy Toledo! Despite being quite busy this afternoon, I logged in to cerb to see if I could use the advice I often find on its pages to help me plan my evening. You know what I mean. To my great surprise I found this thread, and it has kept me busy reading for a good while.

 

It is a GREAT thread of conversation! The best I have found on any of the boards (such as aerb, berb, cerb, derb, eerb, ferb, etc.) My hat is off to Erin, Anessa, and all the other members who have contributed to such a fascinating topic of conversation.

 

Now..... I think I forgot what it was I was looking to do with my evening, so I am off to the library instead, to read more about Mess-o-topia. Silly me, I thought "Mess-o-topia" was the incredibly disorderly state in which my daughter loves to leave her room.

 

OK, back to work. I hope to meet Erin or Anessa at the library tonight.

 

** Despite the sarcastic fun I am having writing this post, I really mean it when I say that I really liked the thread, the opinions on it were totally unexpected and fascinating. Thanks to all for the breadth of views.

 

I'm glad you're enjoying yourself. Welcome :)

[mff69 102]

I don't think its the younger generations problem whatsoever.

And I dont think that the younger generation is "doomed."

 

We're not doomed just because we have different priorities and we grew up in an age with different advancements as you have. We're just different, but the only point that many of you have proven in this thread (other than the select few) is that difference is clearly unbearable to some people.

 

I can speak for myself, many of you would call me a kid at the age of twenty-one, and judging by most of your posts, you'd probably call me doomed and stupid too (just because of the generation that I belong to and I'm not ashamed of it, I dont regret growing up at MY own pace and in my own surroundings), even though you've never met me in your lives.

And actually, upon reading that, many of you will most likely try to find hypocrisy in my words.

 

Oh and I have a treat for you, Erin.

 

"Eric Yam, 17, is the designer of Asten, the grand prize-winning submission in NASA?s International Space Settlement Design Competition. Asten is designed to be built a half-century into the future and to be home to 10,000 inhabitants."

 

IMAGINE THAT, A SEVENTEEN YEAR OLD STUDENT!

 

(I'm adding a link to the article at the bottom among other sources and examples that I am using in MY counter-rant.)

 

People might disregard me as doomed because of the generation that I am a part of but heres a funky fresh little notion to keep in mind.. I SHOWED both of my parents how to use something as simple to me as MSN.

 

I learned how to successfully web design when I was in grade eight!

 

Face it, Younger generations are being exposed to way more things when it comes to technology. Some one brought up the idea of going to libaries. Going to libraries is a good source, but would you rather type something into a machine that can get you imformation instantaneously from the comfort of your own home or pay money to bus all the way down to the public library and risk finding it there or not? Then they called the younger generation "lazy" for choosing not to do so. I think its a smart and the opportunist way actually. If you know how to find it without going through all the extra work, then why the hell not? You have to type the books name into the system at the library to get the reference number anyways??

 

I think "the younger generation is doomed" is a load of crap actually for many other reasons, and I think your parents most likely said the same things about you. And I am sure you HATED it when you heard your parents say you were "doomed" for listening to your favourite band, teasing your hair, using birth control before marriage, having longer hair than all the rest of the boys, not being on the football team like your older brother is, painting your nails, not going off to war when all of the other men are, choosing to hold a "male" job after the men come back from war, not moving to the back of a bus people people tell you that you should, not going to the same university that your father went to or not taking up the family bussiness because you want to run away to New York and becoming an artist instead, because thats what feels right inside of your heart.

 

Older people throughout the generations have scoffed at ALL of these things, and said the exact same things about the younger generation that you all are saying now. I'm sure since many of you are older than me, so I must be less intellegent next to your all mighty capabilities (note the sarcasm) .. that you'll get the people in which I am using reference.

 

And for some of you who understand common sense.. Stupid things arent only being done in this generation, theres clear and blantent evidence in history. There have been mistakes done from MANY different generations. There have been two world wars AND vietnam before I was born, am I corrent? Thats just one example, you don't have to be a Historian to understand my point.

 

Humans are flawed, character comes along with our humanity.. SO ALL of our character is flawed REGARDLESS of the age or time era.. You don't have have as many degree's as many of you guys are talking about in order to figure something as simple as this out?

 

Heres another interesting notion, PEOPLE JUST MAKE THE CHOICES THAT THEY MAKE, REGARDLESS OF HOW OLD THEY ARE. I've seen fully grown adults eff around when they are supposed to be working as well OR make THE dumbest decisions, whats their excuse? Why was O. J. Simpson acquitted? Because of how intellegent of a decision that the opposing party made?

 

"On June 15, 1995, defense attorney Johnnie Cochran goaded an assistant prosecutor into asking Simpson to put on the leather glove that was found at the scene of the crime.

 

The leather glove seemed too tight for Simpson to put on easily, especially over the rubber gloves he wore underneath.[5] Uelmen came up with and Cochran repeated a quip he had used several times in relation to other points in his closing arguments, "If it doesn't fit, you must acquit" often misquoted as "If the glove don't fit, you must acquit." On June 22, 1995, assistant prosecutor Christopher Darden told Judge Lance Ito his concerns that Simpson "has arthritis and we looked at the medication he takes and some of it is anti-inflammatory and we are told he has not taken the stuff for a day and it caused swelling in the joints and inflammation in his hands." The prosecution also stated their belief that the glove shrank from having been soaked in blood and later testing."

 

Hate to break it to all of you, but none of the people are my age who were associated in this trial. It takes at least ten years of school in order to be anywhere close to a degree in law. This is one example of how some one from another age can still make massive mistakes.

 

Why is it that I STILL tell my twenty-six year old sister how to spell words that I find are simple to me, because she doesn't spell as well as I do (but I also am not as good at math as she is, thats JUST ME.), doesnt mean every single person that belongs to her generation sucks at spelling.

 

Quite frankly, your the same age as my older sister Erin. Does this mean that I am better at spelling automatically than you, and that your better in math than me because of my experience with ONE other person the same age as you? For the love of god!

 

Some of you might try to say "but we have more experience than younger people"...

 

"Children are often terrorized into obedience, consistently made to fear for their lives and well-being. They quickly recognize that absolute obedience is the only means to ensure survival. Sometimes they are compelled to participate in the killing of other children or family members, because it is understood by these groups that there is "no way back home" for children after they have committed such crimes."

Can you look a thirteen year old child soldier from Sierra Leone who has been taught the new meaning of "short sleeve" and "long sleeve" and has seen many bloodcurdling wars that you have more experience than him or that you've made tougher decisions just because your older?

 

This is different, not one person has more or less experience than the other (ESPECIALLY with age as I have just proven). Not one single person is comparable to the next, ever. These are just some things that kids in other countries have went through and are still going through as we speak, you have no clue how many other peoples past experiences have made them age either.

 

I do not hold a group of people responsible for decisions that people make. I hold the PERSON responsible REGARDLESS of age, gender, enthnicity OR class.

 

I think the people who the people who retaliated to this are correct soley because MANY of you unfortunately in this thread are lumping a group of people into one category and saying negative things about them. This is seriously wrong.

 

I know what other examples of lumping a specific group of people into one category can be comparable to, and trust me.. you do NOT want that association with your character! Do you know what the examples are that I am speaking about? I mean, many of you say your so smart because your older, oh and you have more experience automatically than anyone else below your age.

 

So tell me, what crimes (heres a hint, it has to do with hate, because thats what it is spawned from) have erupted from people having negative associations with a specific group of people in their mind?

 

I hardly ever post but I HAD to stick up for myself in this case because I believe that this is TOTALLY unjustified, uncalled for and offensive.

 

And please forgive us, if we're not in our mid twenties OR over thirty.. but for the love of god, would most of you PLEASE keep in mind that you weren't born 26+ ???

 

"Seventeen-Year Old Student's" are not your problem Erin among others who have agreed with her, your are probems with generalizing an entire audience of people based on a few peoples actions (which I personally think that I have demonstrated that older people are guilty of doing as well as well from ANY other time era, the nature has just changed that all. With any amount of thought, you can figure this out.).

 

 

Child Soldier Link:

http://www.un.org/children/conflict/english/child-soldiers.html

 

World War One:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_I

 

World War Two:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II

 

Rush Limbaugh:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rush_Limbaugh

 

George Bush:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_W._Bush

 

prize-winning submission in NASA?s International Space Settlement Design Competition:

http://timestranscript.canadaeast.com/whatever/article/711913

 

O.J. Simpson Trial:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/O._J._Simpson_murder_case

[Kathryn Bardot 99339]

Quite frankly, your the same age as my older sister Erin. Does this mean that I am better at spelling automatically than you, and that your better in math than me because of my experience with ONE other person the same age as you? For the love of god!!

1. BREATHE. Take a deep breath in, hold it, and then let it out. Repeat until you don't feel quite so panicked. This was a rant by a frustrated individual, not a personal attack on you.

 

2. My snarky input for the day: No, you are not automatically better at spelling than Erin, because she at least knows the difference between you're and your, and knows how to punctuate accordingly. I'm not going to sit and tear apart your speech, but there are a LOT of errors in there that I'm going to [be nice and] attribute to your frenzied state of mind.

 

3. I agree that under 18s should not be in University. Frankly, I'm against throwing students into University directly from high school, because a good chunk of them [NOTE: I did NOT say "all"] do not have the required life experience to be able to learn via self-direction [ie. compulsory attendance]. At 18, a large percentage of students are unable to choose a career path to stick to until they retire, hence the "quarter-life crisis" we are seeing nowadays.

Does this mean I don't think that there are exceptions to the rule? No. Does this mean I think all 17 year olds to be immature? No. Do I agree with all of Erin's statements? No. However, I recognize and empathize with her frustrations, because I've been there, and I've experienced the same frustrations.

[buggernot 588]

This thread has given me a brilliant concept for a brand new unoriginal TV show which shall be called: 'Are You Smarter Than A Prostitute?' Watch ordinary ignorant people getting brain blasted by brilliant SP's, and then hear them complain afterwards that they lost due to being discombobulated thinking they might get AIDS from being on the show. Number 1 hit for 2 or 3 weeks guaranteed...

Posted via Mobile Device

[VedaSloan 119179]

Jesus effing Christ.

 

My apologies for generalizing; there are a few mature seventeen year olds (I used to be one, and certainly knew better than to disrespect the professor and the people around me by continually talking, even if I wasn't interested in what they were saying), but a rant is about letting off steam, it's not a thesis or dissertation on the state of the world. And I certainly wasn't referring to seventeen year olds the world over, just those in first year at U of O, :P I also think it's a huge leap to describe my post as something that could escalate to a hate crime. Give me a break. Finding something funny that someone else said is hardly a hate crime. I've experienced a hate crime, I would know.

 

I'm just frustrated with the general feeling that the younger folks seem to think that everything should be handed to them and they shouldn't have to do any work, and that includes proofreading (something you should have done before you posted).

 

I also never said younger folk were doomed. I said it was a result of shitty public education and accomodating teachers who hold your hand the whole way and that this was disappointing since YOU are the next generation.

 

Sadly, your post basically illustrated everything I said and guess what? Technology can't do everything for you, and eventually, you'll have to actually visit a library or look up a journal article and OH FUCK, it might not be online. THE NERVE.

 

Fucking hell, I sound like my father. :shock:

 

PS Buggernot, I love you. Fabulous idea.

[buggernot 588]

Well Erin, if I can get the show to come to fruition, you will be the first ho asked to participate. I came up with some catch-phrase gimmickry to give it some identifiable appeal as well. Whenever you trounce an opponent, you get to punch him in the balls and screech out Nelson Muntz style, "Ah-ha...you've been PIMPED, bitch!"

 

I do have to give kudos to mff69 for being able to reference NASA, OJ Simpson, Child Soldiers and Rush Limbaugh all in the same post. Who needs labias when we have Wikipedia? Oops...I mean libaries. What's that spell check? That's not a word? Fuck you computer, quit underlining everything I write you piece of shit technology fucker...

[Kathryn Bardot 99339]

Whenever you trounce an opponent, you get to punch him in the balls and screech out Nelson Muntz style, "Ah-ha...you've been PIMPED, bitch!"

Pure gold! Can I play, too?

[buggernot 588]

Pure gold! Can I play, too?

 

Of course you can, guess I'll have to hold some auditions. No need to practice the catch-phrase on me though please!

[mff69 102]

"I'm just frustrated with the general feeling that the younger folks seem to think that everything should be handed to them and they shouldn't have to do any work, and that includes proofreading (something you should have done before you posted)."

 

This is why I said I knew people would try to find hypocrisy or error in my words based soley upon me coming out and explaining that I am twenty-one.

 

Erin and Kate, I didn't type out my section anticipating to be scrutinized for my spelling. Believe it or not, I did not put that much effort into typing something out for the sole reason for you to say "but your a bad speller." Thanks for the comments though.. I really appreciated the attacks on my grammar. It was a pretty low blow given the fact that I had alot of other things to say and you pretty much didn't touch on ANY of my other examples at all. That was very classy of you.

 

Oh and my post obviously didn't "outline everything that you said." If you said something initially that I would have agreed with, then why do you think I wrote out a post telling you exactly why I think that your completely wrong. Thanks for trying to take my words and make them your own though at last minute. FAIL.

 

Oh, and Kate one more thing.. Why would you refer to me as frenzied? I have provided clear examples that support my points without so much as calling a single person a name. I wanted to get my point across, that was my only interest whatsoever. I can't account for if you misunderstood my text or my tone. You should be flattered that I actually put that much effort into a response when the topic was that assinine to begin with.

 

You haven't gotten under my skin.

 

I am not frenzied because I believe that there are people that are intolerant and self righteous everywhere in the world. Your responses just speak for themselves.

 

And to be honest with you, yes, many of you actually are extremely guilty of attacking young people in a macrocosm judging by YOUR WORDS. If you don't believe it to be so, then simply press the back button and read. I don't even have to reference this time because so many attacks are repeated over and over again by multiple members. This is quite evident and crystal clear.

 

Oh and Erin, you say you have fallen victim to hate crimes and stereotyping.. I would think that you would not behave this way if you knew exactly how it felt to be at the other end of the spectrum? No?

[Kathryn Bardot 99339]

Erin and Kate, I didn't type out my section anticipating to be scrutinized for my spelling. Believe it or not, I did not put that much effort into typing something out for the sole reason for you to say "but your a bad speller." Thanks for the comments though.. I really appreciated the attacks on my grammar. It was a pretty low blow given the fact that I had alot of other things to say and you pretty much didn't touch on ANY of my other examples at all. That was very classy of you.

 

Oh, and Kate one more thing.. Why would you refer to me as frenzied? I have provided clear examples that support my points without so much as calling a single person a name. I wanted to get my point across, that was my only interest whatsoever. I can't account for if you misunderstood my text or my tone. You should be flattered that I actually put that much effort into a response when the topic was that assinine to begin with.

 

I should be flattered? Why? This wasn't my post to begin with, so it really doesn't matter to me whether you decide you grace us with your presence or not. And you don't really care about how you come across in an argument, because you can't be bothered to spell YOU'RE and YOUR correctly? I don't sit here and spell check my posts either, yet I seem to be able to spell things correctly.

Hey genius, here's a tip from one university student to another - spell check is going to be your friend for all those term papers you'll be writing. It doesn't matter if you have a solid argument, you still won't get an A if you can't spell or use proper grammar. No one is going to take you seriously when you obviously haven't mastered grammar they teach in elementary school. And THAT is what a large part of the original rant is about - you're being lazy because technology will surely do it for you, right? Wikipedia is NOT a reference, and spell check won't be able to help you when you're writing that exam paper.

 

No, I didn't touch on your other points, because your argument is so poorly constructed that it's not worth my time to try and decipher your ranting. Pure and simple, if I have to wade through the "argument" you've just vomited all over the page, I'm not going to bother. Neither will your professors.

[mff69 102]

Once again,

 

Like I said clearly in my first post, if anyone had been paying any kind of attention to my post in its entirety (and beyond a grammatical error, so sue me if I'm human okay? I didn't ever claim to be anything otherwise, why don't you try to find that in my post too?) then they would realize that I already knew that people WOULD do THIS.

 

ie. try to find simple errors in what I say because their clearly afraid of my confidence level and ability to provide a solid and sound argument. Why don't you provide some kind of argument about WHAT I AM SAYING rather than clearly hiding behind useless cop-outs. THats exactly what you are doing.

 

Oh, and not every single person catches typo's every single time they make one. I didn't think I would actually have to address a point so miniscule, but obviously that is the only thing that you have on my text in its entirety of what I said. To be honest with you, I was expecting a bit more of a stimulating post.

 

Why don't you go ahead and come right out and say it, seeing as you already practically did.

 

"I am going to strain my eyes to look through this users text for a couple grammatical errors (and or) typo's and then use it against them with the petty argument of 'SEE ALL KIDS THESE DAYS ARE SOOOO LAZY. OMFGZ, I HAVE A POINT!' because I can't touch anything else that they said."

 

God, people can be so obvious sometimes.

 

Sorry, but if you had put more thought into your posts than you wouldn't be generalizing a vast audience of people, continuing to do so and defending the point in doing so.

 

Maybe I would take what you said more seriously if you can provide clear examples of why you honestly think what you say to actually be the truth and how stereotyping people based on meaningless information has benefit people in a whole.

 

I've done my research, and I know stereotyping is wrong.

 

What about you?

 

 

By the way, I am under ten years younger than you. So just some words of advice, get off your high horse. Our generations have more in common than any other of them actually, so I recommend you suck it up and become friends because our generations are tied much closer than you think compared to any other existing one.

 

You keep saying that you hate the fact that the teachers "hold the students hands." I haven't seen this excessively done compared to how it might have been done with my older siblings or my cousins, but you must ask yourself one thing.

 

Is it the students fault for holding the teachers hand, or the teachers fault for holding it out and promoting it?

 

You should feel privleged, I actually do think I am doing you a favour. I would rather you offend some one belonging to the group you are attacking over the internet who actually puts effort into trying to help you see the error of your ways, rather than some one who doesn't have the patience level that I have and makes a nasty oppinion about your generation based on only your actions.

 

Then where does the hatred end?

[YoungStud 468]

And now for something completely different.

[o*****j***e 136]

This turned out to be an amusing thread. Thanks Erin!

[bylogger 136]

I guess I have been lucky. Yes, I see my fair share of university students who seem to be unaware of the world. Generally inexperienced. At the same time, I have not lost hope in them. I see them become interested, engaged, and even passionate (not that way!) and I feel energized as another student "gets it", understands the importance of the subject.

 

I believe there have always been people who grew up learning as little as they could, depending on leaders. Sometimes those leaders actually knew more, and could make good decisions for the tribe, or citizens.

 

As to spelling. Yes, incorrect grammar and spelling irritate me. And I have been known to tell a student that if they do not respect their own work, why should I mark it? Then hand it back to them, requiring them to rework the essay. I am delighted when after they hand it in again, that they realise their work is better.

 

I look at the students as developing citizens. I can get angry, or I can mentor.

[Kubrickfan 12836]

And now for something completely different.

 

+1000 AGREED. OR as Bart Simpson would say, "wow, man."

 

I think a fair summary of this whole thread is, "those young whipper-snappers, they dont know how good they have it!" Which I agree with (smile).

 

and

 

"Dont overgeneralize, you old fart" which I also agree with. (smile)

 

Every older generation thinks the younger generation has it easier, and every younger generation disagrees. So what? Its a fun discussion which is supposed to elicit more laughter than anger.

 

To start talking about others verbally attacking people ... jeez, with all due respect mff69, you are taking this way too personally IMHO. Cerb is a great place to discuss some really interesting topics with some really interesting people ... we should all lighten up.