Bill C-36 How long do we have?

[drlove 37204]

How long before bill C-36 becomes law? I want to get as much fun in as I can beforehand.

[Studio 110 by Sophia 150333]

Ohhhh dear, you do not need to think that way. Even if it does become law, if you never ask for sexual services, and we never advertise it, who is to say anything?? Are they in the room with you? Is there an email/txt of you asking for BBJ? MSOG? NO there will not be. They having nothing to charge you with.

 

IF it is, then just follow simple rules, when booking a new lady, DONT ASK FOR SEX, ASK HOW MUCH IS YOUR TIME? And go blindly hoping to have all you desire fulfilled. If she is not your kind of girl you just do not return for more...if it is, the super!! You just got yourself a regular SP :)

 

Think of this..example of a txt

 

Hello, are you available to meet me, I was thinking of having company for one hour. what is your rate.

 

My time for an hour is XXX. You can call me for location and confirmation.

 

THEN you arrive and we have tea and cookies.

 

Who knows??

[drlove 37204]

The only reason I asked is because someone on another board said it would be law by about June 20th, but that makes no sense. After all, doesn't a bill need to be read about three times, then get referred to a committee and then have the Senate vote on it before it receives royal ascent? Hard to believe that all that can happen in two to three weeks!

[Studio 110 by Sophia 150333]

I highly doubt that soon, as 3 reading plus there is a summer recess..

[Ice4fun 78407]

There is no way the Government of Canada can move that fast... i would bet late fall...but suite Escapes is right... this is a terrible bill but not the end of the hobby.

 

I wish there was a way to force the Government to refer their new legislation back to the SCC... i think it would be thrown out.

 

Just my opinion.

[Kathryn Bardot 99339]

How does a bill become a law?

 

In order for a bill to become a law, it must go through a number of specific stages in both the Senate and the House of Commons. The process in each Chamber is similar.

House of Commons

 

Introduction and First Reading: The bill is introduced after notice is given; it is then assigned a number and printed.

Second Reading: The principle of the bill is debated and the bill is referred to a committee for more detailed study. (In the House of Commons, it is possible to refer a bill to committee prior to second reading pursuant to Standing Order 73.)

Committee Consideration: After a detailed analysis of the bill, often involving the hearing of witnesses, and a clause-by-clause study, the committee reports the bill back to the House of Commons.

Report Stage: The bill, as passed by the committee, is considered by the House and further amendments can be proposed and debated.

Third Reading: The bill, as adopted at the report stage, is debated a final time. Debate focuses on the final form of the bill.

Passage and Royal Assent: If the bill originated in the House of Commons and is passed at the third reading stage, it is sent to the Senate where it will follow the process described below. If the bill originated in the Senate and has been passed by both chambers in the same form, it is presented for Royal Assent.

 

Senate

 

Introduction and First Reading: The bill is introduced without notice, given a number and printed.

Second Reading: The principle of the bill is debated at second reading and, if it passes, the bill is almost always referred to a committee for more detailed study. (In the Senate, it is possible for a committee to study the subject matter of a bill introduced in the House of Commons prior to introduction in the Senate, pursuant to Rule 74 of the Rules of the Senate. This is referred to as pre-study. The Senate may also refer the subject matter of a bill to a committee before the bill has received second reading.)

Committee Stage: The committee studies the bill and reports it back to the Senate.

Report Stage: The Senate only considers a bill at report stage if the committee either recommends amendments or that the bill not be further studied. Committee reports on bills that do not propose amendments are deemed adopted by the Senate without a motion.

Third Reading: The bill, as amended by the Senate or not, is debated a third time. Debate focuses on the final form of the bill, although amendments to clauses of the bill can also be moved at this stage without the need to return it to committee.

Passage and Royal Assent: If the bill originated in the Senate and is passed, it is then sent to the House of Commons where it follows the process described above. If the bill originated in the House of Commons and has been passed by both chambers in the same form, it is presented for Royal Assent

http://www.parl.gc.ca/LEGISinfo/Faq....E&Mode=1#ID0EQ

[PistolPete 61421]

Really shouldn't listen or put a whole lot of value in some posts on boards as far as I'm concerned. Kathryn above gave you the appropriate information regarding a new bill becoming law.

 

 

 

The only reason I asked is because someone on another board said it would be law by about June 20th, but that makes no sense. After all, doesn't a bill need to be read about three times, then get referred to a committee and then have the Senate vote on it before it receives royal ascent? Hard to believe that all that can happen in two to three weeks!

[roamingguy 300292]

Were people who are this concerned about the new bill just as concerned about the old legislation

Under the old legislation for example, well how many guys saw ladies from agencies, or went to a ladies incall just as a couple examples. There were restrictions under the old legislation but no one seemed too concerned about some of those laws

And the police could have done stings, but they didn't...not a law enforcement priority, either under the old law, or as I predict, the new law either

My two cents

 

RG

[drlove 37204]

Were people who are this concerned about the new bill just as concerned about the old legislation

Under the old legislation for example, well how many guys saw ladies from agencies, or went to a ladies incall just as a couple examples. There were restrictions under the old legislation but no one seemed too concerned about some of those laws

And the police could have done stings, but they didn't...not a law enforcement priority, either under the old law, or as I predict, the new law either

My two cents

 

RG

 

You're probably right. I'd say the main difference for me is that the old laws offered a legal loophole whereby outcalls were (and still are for now) 100% legal. All that changes in Mackay's new bill.

[Studio 110 by Sophia 150333]

Although I agree RG, I can say as an agent, that I fear agencies will be a "person of interest" as agencies are stationary and not traveling as INDY.

Because of our stationary status, we will be more easily able to attract attention. Not to mention the plethora of " bad agencies" out there, they are more likely to look at ALL agencies as " bad" ....BUT NOT ME because I will not advertise sex nor answer any enquiry suggesting as such.

 

Myself has faced on 2 occasions with a " notice" on my door that there a suspected " illegal massage parlor" in the neighborhood. But nothing ever happened because I was SOLO at that time and not commercial. I obviously figured this was some competition that wanted me gone.

 

NOW I own my house, with a separate apartment built with in. I never did high volume revolving door style, but yet thee was a complaint against me and the POPO had no choice but to check it out.

 

SO....If I never admit, communicate or advertise sexual services, then I suppose they have nothing to go on.

[fortunateone 156618]

There is a lengthy discussion here. I'm sure all the topics, as well as some fear mongering and hysterics, will be thrashed out lol

 

 

http://www.cerb.ca/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=181850

 

 

 

A bill is not a law. A bill is something the one presenting the bill would like to be a law. keep in mind Joy Smith already presented a bill which no one agreed would be a law, it didn't make it past one of the required readings? Someone could fill in the details there. If the mcKay bill is a copy of that one, it may suffer the same short life of no one wanting to see it past the introduction.

 

General public opinion seems to think they've lost their minds with what they've come up with

 

http://www.cbc.ca/newsblogs/politics/inside-politics-blog/2013/06/power-politics-ballot-box-question-281.html

[fortunateone 156618]

^^^ I think a lot of people forget that each and every day, even with the exchange of $$ for sexual activities, the majority of sps/clients have been breaking a variety of laws for about 30 years now. It is a criminal act to be in an incall provided by the sp (bawdy house). If you do street work, it is a criminal act to discuss in public the conditions of paying for sexual activities with the sp. If you use an agency, 'technically' they are procuring for you by advertising the sp services and connecting you with that sp, and sending her to you (in their own vehicles), and if you go to the mp, again it is a bawdy house, with or without a bodyrub city license.

 

The question with those laws is one of enforcement. Massage parlours are infrequently raided, and street workers and their clients were constantly charged or stings in place. SWs will continue to be the easy fix and the easy target. Incalls and indy sps will continue to be the things LE doesn't enforce because of time and $$ constraints, and the fact the pay off is simply not there. If they do sting, they will probably stick to what works, and what is worthwhile doing, as in charges against clients seeking the services of under 18 sps.

[Nicolette Vaughn 294340]

Ohhhh dear, you do not need to think that way. Even if it does become law, if you never ask for sexual services, and we never advertise it, who is to say anything?? Are they in the room with you? Is there an email/txt of you asking for BBJ? MSOG? NO there will not be. They having nothing to charge you with.

 

IF it is, then just follow simple rules, when booking a new lady, DONT ASK FOR SEX, ASK HOW MUCH IS YOUR TIME? And go blindly hoping to have all you desire fulfilled. If she is not your kind of girl you just do not return for more...if it is, the super!! You just got yourself a regular SP :)

 

Think of this..example of a txt

 

Hello, are you available to meet me, I was thinking of having company for one hour. what is your rate.

 

My time for an hour is XXX. You can call me for location and confirmation.

 

THEN you arrive and we have tea and cookies.

 

Who knows??

 

This sounds just like the old days except for the texting part. LOL! When I first started as an SP, the ladies did NOT speak about sexual services on the phone ( acronyms did not exist), no one negotiated, there was none of this 15 minute b.s. or "How much for just a bj?" The client paid the rate for "time and companionship" which was reiterated over and over to each client. The client anticipated a good time. If they didn't, they never called back to repeat with that particular SP. The lady showed up, she didn't touch the envelope until some sort of sexual advance was made by either her or the client. That's how you knew neither was LE.

 

The laws were consdiered a grey area back then and during this time in Ottawa, incalls were not a popular choice among SPs. If they did offer them, it was with established regulars. As years passed, SPs and clients alike became more courageous because they knew LE weren't enforcing the laws if you kept your head down and flew under the radar. The industry changed and kept evolving and business carried on.

 

This is how it was always done in the early days ( before the internet and when the internet was in its infancy with escort industry sites) and this is the way it will have to be done again. If certain laws are passed especially regarding bawdy houses and making sure no one under the age of 18 is or could be present, the question will be how far LE will go to enforce such laws if passed? Will they have the budget to do it? It will be interesting to see how it plays out and how far they will go to prosecute. As Forunateone pointed out, they will go after the easiest targets and that's sexworkers who are on the streets.

[Guest C*****tte]

We have not heard a response from police as far as I know. I wonder if they are struggling with how they will enforce these laws and how they will pay for this enforcement. Especially the new one regarding online advertising. Would it be a cyber crime unit? There are so many worse crimes online with regards to hate speech, child abuse, identity theft, stalking and financial stuff. They don't even have the means to tackle those.

 

Additional Comments:

This sounds just like the old days except for the texting part. LOL! When I first started as an SP, the ladies did NOT speak about sexual services on the phone ( acronyms did not exist), no one negotiated, there was none of this 15 minute b.s. or "How much for just a bj?" The client paid the rate for "time and companionship" which was reiterated over and over to each client. The client anticipated a good time. If they didn't, they never called back to repeat with that particular SP.

 

The lady showed up, she didn't touch the envelope until some sort of sexual advance was made by either her or the client. That's how you knew neither was LE.

 

This is how it was always done and this is the way it will have to be done again. If certain laws are passed especially regarding bawdy houses and making sure no one under the age of 18 is or could be present, the question will be how far LE will go to enforce these new laws? Will they have the budget to do it? It will be interesting to see how it plays out and how far they will go to prosecute. As Forunateone pointed out, they will go after the easiest targets and that's sexworkers who are on the streets.

 

I am expecting to see people saying 1 hour = 1 rose!

[drlove 37204]

General public opinion seems to think they've lost their minds with what they've come up with

 

http://www.cbc.ca/newsblogs/politics/inside-politics-blog/2013/06/power-politics-ballot-box-question-281.html

 

Do you have the link to the current prostitution poll? This one is for something else from 2013

[fortunateone 156618]

We have not heard a response from police as far as I know. I wonder if they are struggling with how they will enforce these laws and how they will pay for this enforcement. Especially the new one regarding online advertising. Would it be a cyber crime unit? There are so many worse crimes online with regards to hate speech, child abuse, identity theft, stalking and financial stuff. They don't even have the means to tackle those.

 

Additional Comments:

 

 

I am expecting to see people saying 1 hour = 1 rose!

 

I read a story from the city of Calgary council person who said they did not think the nordic model (i.e. this model) was a good idea. LE themselves seem to think it is, tho i think the Calgary chief of police had much to say in support of it.

 

However, keeping in mind that a lot of people supportive of the intent of the Nordic model are not supportive at all about what C-36 is all about.

 

Additional Comments:

Do you have the link to the current prostitution poll? This one is for something else from 2013

 

It isn't from 2013, that is just the way it appears. The poll itself was specific to a recent article in the cbc site. And today,. the link is now going for a different story, about social media and the police. I am guessing their site is not well set up?

[peacectryguy 12547]

Myself, I don't see this stupid thing ever being the law of the land. It is just too ill-conceived and badly written to have any real legs. I see it as McKay and Harper trying to appease the right wing side for the election and nothing more. I just am not too worried at this point. Also, as has been mentioned, enforcing it is a nightmare for the cops. They don't have the resources to do what everybody seems to be worried about. They will instead, go after easy targets. They do this in the US all the time. When the street walkers become too visible and complaints start, they put on a show of "cracking down". Then tell the ladies to be more discreet and the ladies move somewhere less in the "soccer mom's" eyes. The cops then go back to ignoring it. They rarely if ever target the high end escort biz.

[fortunateone 156618]

I wonder if it might go back to codes, like half hour rate was actually a bj only rate, and the hour rate meant FS?

 

But that is just advertising, and isn't it supposed to be that sps themselves can post ads for themselves, and since what they offer and sell isn't supposed to be criminalized, they are free to say and post whatever they wish? as long as the cost to post the ad is free, and no one is making money off her posting the ad?

[Studio 110 by Sophia 150333]

I wonder if it might go back to codes, like half hour rate was actually a bj only rate, and the hour rate meant FS?

 

But that is just advertising, and isn't it supposed to be that sps themselves can post ads for themselves, and since what they offer and sell isn't supposed to be criminalized, they are free to say and post whatever they wish? as long as the cost to post the ad is free, and no one is making money off her posting the ad?

 

 

Actually yes, this used to be code, either HH ( half service ) or hour was ( full services).

 

And Yes as INDY you may post an ad, BUT....by advertising anything that is " sexual service" IE: GFE/PSE etc, would also incriminate your clientele. Merely responding to a " sexual ad" can be seen as " communication with the purpose of" ....

 

so as I have stated many times, as long as our ads and enquiries are for time only, there is no case to build upon.